Donald Trump and US politics

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morbo wrote:

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faerwin wrote:

It's a step in the right direction, one that will eventually allow the situation to be normalized and then drop that quota entirely.

There is nothing to normalize, because those racial laws from 80 years ago don't exist anymore. A 20 yo person today did not benefit anything from those past racial laws, so he should not bear any burden. Positive discrimination should not exist anymore, because those who benefited from racial laws are mostly already dead or out of the job market.

The problem is with leftist, who assume that in their "perfect" society every race or gender would have a 50%/50% distribution everywhere. So until we achieve this equality of outcome, we must force discriminate against the successful to prop up the not-so-successful. Which is just another communistic utopian idea.

Also, ideologies like feminism have become a lobby and a racket. So, even if there are now more women in college in US than men, you still have feminist lobby pushing for privileges for women. It's not about equality anymore.

Segregation was still very present in many states until recent history (recent history is 30 years~).

Sure, in the northern states, it's less present and I imagine it might even be entirely absent in some areas, but it's an issue that needs federal involvement to force the hand of the more reluctant states to accept minorities as of equal value (by that, I mean before taking count of actual skill sets).

That said, I do think that these laws should be phased out soon and should be on a constant re-evaluation.

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pneuma wrote:

You can't be "proud" of your culture's past achievements -- you weren't there. You can actively decide to involve yourself in the culture that you were raised in and you can celebrate its successes and feel shame for its failures or you can find a new culture by taking another active choice.

If you can't be proud of your country (people, culture, whatever), then you also can't be ashamed of it - which is obviously false, since you have so many people in the West now who feel shame for past things they didn't have any influence on: exterminating Indians, colonialism, Nazism, dropping nukes on Japan...

If you are able to celebrate success about abstract concepts you didn't do or people you didn't influence, then you are also able to feel pride for the same things.

Just liberal BS. Equality of results. Same reason they steal ppls paycheck to nanny others. Like I said in other thread end game Venezuela because producers are like fuck it I wont play ball anymore if reward not high. Hope they never get in power again. Russians put them in concentration camps or else work but don't think that will fly in 21st century.

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morbo wrote:

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pneuma wrote:

You can't be "proud" of your culture's past achievements -- you weren't there. You can actively decide to involve yourself in the culture that you were raised in and you can celebrate its successes and feel shame for its failures or you can find a new culture by taking another active choice.

If you can't be proud of your country...

Bolded the part you missed.

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Aim_Deep wrote:

Just liberal BS. Equality of results.

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pneuma wrote:

I'm promoting egalitarianism. I'm about as opposed to "equality of outcome" as is possible, so I'm very confused about how you got that out of what I wrote.

Best way to "promote egalitarianism" is anarcho-capitalism. Worst way is govt interference of any sort but protecting property and life. This is history.

What of anything that I said disagrees with that?

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Aim_Deep wrote:

Best way to "promote egalitarianism" is anarcho-capitalism. Worst way is govt interference of any sort but protecting property and life. This is history.

As much as American like to dub the U.S. economic system as "capitalism" or "market economy." The government high level of state participation and spending would place it as considerably as a mixed economy.

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Aim_Deep wrote:

Best way to "promote egalitarianism" is anarcho-capitalism. Worst way is govt interference of any sort but protecting property and life. This is history.

You're slowly becoming a meme dude.

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morbo wrote:

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pneuma wrote:

You can't be "proud" of your culture's past achievements -- you weren't there. You can actively decide to involve yourself in the culture that you were raised in and you can celebrate its successes and feel shame for its failures or you can find a new culture by taking another active choice.

If you can't be proud of your country (people, culture, whatever), then you also can't be ashamed of it - which is obviously false, since you have so many people in the West now who feel shame for past things they didn't have any influence on: exterminating Indians, colonialism, Nazism, dropping nukes on Japan...

Technically, one cannot be proud nor ashamed of anything oneself does not do. However, since the self is watched within the confines of one's consciousness, one can be proud or ashamed of virtually any trivial action of consciousness. One can't be directly proud of two and two equalling four, but one can be of realizing 2+2=4, or saying "2+2=4," or even merely thinking it for the 3,726th time.

Unfortunately, "pride" is usually used in this cognitive context rather than a physical or properly social one. It's not so much that they feel proud so much as they've proud feels. Spectators glorifying spectators. The accomplishments of a life lived vicariously. This is your brain; this is your brain high on premature congratulations.

Obviously, such pride is misguided. A good rule of thumb: if you're not slightly out of breath, you probably shouldn't feel proud about what you've just accomplished. There is an evolutionary reason why the chemicals released by exercise are so helpful to mental health.

The proper response to the heroes in one's life, one's history, one's mythology, et cetera, is not the self-reverence of pride but the bended knee of humility. It is our heroes who show us higher standards exist and make us see the errors of our former ways. Wayne and Garth have the right idea: we're not worthy. Though perhaps, with time and effort, we one day can be.

So while I see good in your respect for your antecedents, morbo, it is still not pride in them that is called for, except perhaps in the context of pride in one's own actions defending them. If anything, the appropriate response is the opposite of pride.

I do disagree with pneuma regarding shame for actions one had no choice in. Shaming is more appropriate.

Saying you're hoping for a particular outcome isn't obstruction of justice. This, however...:

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Stunning Coverup Maneuver – Obama NSC Move All Intelligence Unmasking Material To Obama Library To Avoid Sunlight…

https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2017/06/19/stunning-coverup-manuever-obama-nsc-move-all-intelligence-unmasking-material-to-obama-library-to-avoid-sunlight/#more-134598

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A FOIA request from Judicial Watch to the Obama NSC seeking information about the unmasking activities of National Security Advisor Susan Rice and the National Security Council receives a response that all documentation has been moved to the Obama Library.

The reason: All presidential library material is NOT subject to public scrutiny until FIVE YEARS after the administration ends.

This is a delaying tactic which gambles against the prospect of another Republican presidency in 2021. It remains to be seen if this material can be deemed privileged, or if it is, in fact, property of the Republic. ='[.]'=