Nerf life nodes... while boosting base life so life itself isn't nerfed

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comeoutandplay wrote:

we dont need scrubcore suggestions go back to d3 thx

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bull sry but it really is

there is an extreme problem/balance issue in PoE where there is no way around it you need a minimum of 200% extra life to make it viable for you to do endgame thats 200/8= 25 nodes in the worst case scenario plus the nodes needed to get there that in itself is probably around 30-35 nodes thats 50 nodes already most people will have around 100 nodes available at the end i haven't heard anyone hitting the lvl cap yet so that half your nodes spent just to get the neccesary life nodes if your melee its even worse.

ofc you can get a CI user

congratz you have now 2 possible ways of building your character health or energy shield

doesn't leave much room for build variety does it?

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

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realatomicpanda wrote:

But if you look at someone who, with their current build and gear, has 5-6k hp and is running difficult, higher level maps, are they going to want to drop some life nodes to take other nodes, even if life nodes were changed to only be half as effective as they are now? I doubt it, because you can never have enough life. That's why people who stack life nodes often end up getting a Kaom's Heart too. Because even with all those life nodes, they STILL don't have enough life.

What you're basically saying here is that your character needs 5-6k hp in order to be effective... which I think is an utter fallacy, and a partial byproduct of the 8% lifenode system.

I'm sure there are people running the same content with 3-4k life. Although they're probably nearer to 4k, some of those are probably melee. So is it really true you can never have enough life?

I think the main drive to surpass these reasonably life levels is that the return on investment is too substantial. To you, 3-4k life don't feel like breakpoints, because they aren't the current breakpoints, it's still more profitable -- not necessary, profitable -- to get life past that amount. This is exactly what my suggestion is attacking.

To do end level maps, you definitely do. Early level maps you need around 3k hp

The reason is simple, there are so many mechanics in PoE that can kill you (before you can do anything about it) unless you have a massive buffer of HP. Whether its shock stacking, or increased crit + crit damage, or getting frozen infront of a pack of mobs, or getting perma stunned by a pack of roas if you dont have unwavering/khoulas. Dying at this point in game is literally losing hours of farm (15% exp penalty). The mechanics in their design penalize you much more the less survivability you have, and the latest damage buffs just put things over the line

The only exception to this is probably summoners, even then they do have issues (mainly QoL ones regarding being able to control your summons the way you want to)

Good news is, in the manifesto Chris has said that they are going to reevaluate many of the non life based defensive mechanics (ES, armor and evasion) to try and improve their defensive value

please GGGG do this and rebalance base life and life nodes!! to play hardcore koams is almost a requirement and after the Chance orbs change i think i wont be even able to ever find one :(

Man, right now we are missing hybrid nodes. How would be if some of life nodes gets nerfed on percentage only to give another bonus together? Examples
1- Instead of +8% life, why not +4% life with +4% projectile damage?
2- Instead of +8% life, +4% life with +4% chaos resistance?
...
You've got an idea...

This change is a 100% no brainer.

There's nothing 'pro' about stacking life nodes. A 10 minute forum search pre-character creation shows that it's necessary to make a viable character.

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polewacs wrote:

This change is a 100% no brainer.

There's nothing 'pro' about stacking life nodes. A 10 minute forum search pre-character creation shows that it's necessary to make a viable character.

Agreed.
However they should consider adding more hybrid life plus X nodes.
X in this case means another bonus besides life, like ES, armor, evasion, damage, accuracy, critical, minion, elemental stuff, whatever devs want for an especific hybrid node.
Example: +5% life plus +5% melee physical damage

true, hybrid nodes would be good but also become neccssary for certain builds - but no for every

however i think the most important thing is to rebalance you base life ... it cant be that you get more damage from one single hit than you actually have without speccing life ...

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Vakirauta wrote:

What is this going to change? This is only going to make life-user builds more and more OP, because they'll be able to take more than life nodes in their builds, and still be able to compete because their base life is #a number#

You mean in terms of the hybrid nodes? Not really my suggestion, and for good reason -- unless you used really low percents, like 1% or 2%, the nodes would be good enough for people to take them even if they had no interest in the other stat. 5% is way too much.

I agree with the life statment, but not really with all the other propositions because of one thing : reflect.

Actually, you have to take a huge number of life nodes for your survivability, and often people use bloodmagic (gem of passive), in addition with life regen. But if we follow your idea less life but buffs on other defensive types or hybrid nodes to get more DPS.
But actually even the builds that use a lot of life nodes can reach a dps value that can easily overcome their life when they face a reflect mob (even worse with reduce resists).
In conclusion i think yes life nodes are too much important but if they make the changes you propose i won't take them because :
-It would make me weaker against reflect
-A build with a lot of life + life regen allows me to perma shoot my 5-6L skill AND to run 5, 6, 7 powerfull auras.

It's impossible because :
-changing life nodes values would require to give each character a full respec (and needing to take 15-20 life nodes from 120 skill points doesn't seem crazy for me, it's a mandatory for me)


But I still agree, actually I crave to make a king of the hill build, but without a Lion's glare I need to get accuracies nodes and crit nodes, and to get enough i need to sacrifice too much life/defensive nodes and by extension I also will have problems with mana regens.

In conclusion I would say GGG knows that, they realize (as everybody) how some keystones are too imba (RT, BM, IR, %ele dmg, ...) that ruins chances to see many creative builds (viable at lvl85).
For me the root of the problem :p is that blood magic + RT is too much imba :
Ranged are better than melees ( even GGG said it ), and the combination of having a lot of life + BM + life regen offering you too much survivability AND sustainability AND the ability to stack 6 auras AND saving mana nodes + RT/Lion's eye allowing you to save TOO MANY ACCU nodes and mods + efficiency (aka LOH/LL).

I think this has been already said but I think the OP thread is good but not aiming the real problem, it's just that those builds (using life) are way too powerfull comparing to builds that doesn't rely on BM (except casters).

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It's impossible because :
-changing life nodes values would require to give each character a full respec (and needing to take 15-20 life nodes from 120 skill points doesn't seem crazy for me, it's a mandatory for me)

it takes for a marauder who has easiest acces on the tree to life nodes exactly 52 nodes to get above 200% life that is included in getting resolute strike otherwise you wont be hitting anything thus fail at leveling no resists nodes no armor nodes no offensive nodes nothing pure the str nodes needed for him to get at life clusters for most people that's more then half the nodes to get the required life. now you need to start worrying about stuff like better armor values or otherwise your still fuked

i personally think we need to be able to improve the flat mount of hp we receive from both str and leveling so we are esp melee since they suffer the most from this reliant on gear

im fine with having to rely on gear for gem slots and links
im fine with gear boosting our stats and that there is a certain dependancy on this
im not fine with the fact that rng in this game can literally cripple your character

Im considered a hardcore gamer in the respect that i play competetive and not casual "its just a game" I wana be good at a game but it should not force me to farm 10 hours a day just to get what i need. and the way life works it certainly contributes to this.

so yes i agree with the problem OP adresses perhaps not in the way he wants to solve it but it should def be adressed.