Lightning Penetration

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taekvideo wrote:

I'd really like a clarification.
In pvp, if you're fighting an opponent who has 200% lightning resist (capped at 80), will this "reduce" their resist to 175% (still capped at 80) or does it take the 80% and drop it down to 55%?

the first answer.

also 200% light res? damn...

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soul4hdwn wrote:

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taekvideo wrote:

I'd really like a clarification.
In pvp, if you're fighting an opponent who has 200% lightning resist (capped at 80), will this "reduce" their resist to 175% (still capped at 80) or does it take the 80% and drop it down to 55%?

the first answer.

also 200% light res? damn...

Lol 200% is definitely possible... and we should expect to see it in pvp since there's a lot of ways to reduce resists (curses, ee, penetration)... if you're only sitting at barely 75% and your opponent hits you with -150% resists (-200% or so is the max possible), you'll take 7 times as much damage (ie welcome to oneshotville), but if you're stacked well past your cap then you'll avoid a lot of that pain.

what are you sacrificing to get that, i really don't understand why people care for pvp and would hinder themselves during the trip to get to a proper pvp area...
also -225% res is at absolute max lv of 3 res reducing related gems + eqilibrium. it'll be harder to get to max player level on future updates due to more content to get through. also lv 70 vs lv 100

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soul4hdwn wrote:

what are you sacrificing to get that, i really don't understand why people care for pvp and would hinder themselves during the trip to get to a proper pvp area...
also -225% res is at absolute max lv of 3 res reducing related gems + eqilibrium. it'll be harder to get to max player level on future updates due to more content to get through. also lv 70 vs lv 100

Resists come from suffixes, and there are tons of available suffixes, especially when you don't need any iiq/iir (for pvp).

You don't have to use a pvp build the entire time you're leveling up / farming... you can change your passives/gear once you get to a really high lvl and have enough currency to buy everything you need for that character.

I don't think we have to quite worry about -225%... it'd be a lot of work for someone to do that and you could always pop a warding flask to eliminate half of that. I'll probably be stacking 100% or so past my cap for pvp.

Do any of the penetration supports appear as quest rewards?

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CanHasPants wrote:

Do any of the penetration supports appear as quest rewards?

They do drop as quest rewards, for the Which at least. Probably the other two Int classes as well, but I wouldn't know about the rest.


I have a question that isn't really about the gem, but the mobs you would want it for. What are mob resistances capped at, or what are they on average (a non-lightning resist mob in Cruel or higher, for instance). When I see "Resists Lightning" how much resistance are we talking about?


Also, coming from League of Legends I need to know about the specific wording. In LoL when it says "armor penetration" it means you will ignore that much armor on the enemy, but if they have lower than that it will not go below 0. For example, they have 10 armor and I have 20 penetration, it treats them as having 0 armor.

When it says "reduction" it means it is possible to reduce the armor into the negative values (making armor penetration useless, as it won't count below 0), which causes them to take more damage. For example, 10 armor and 20 reduction will put them at -10 and they will take extra damage. If this is the case, is there a cap on negative resistance I should know about?

Perhaps I misunderstood, but it sounds like the gem actually treats the mob as having 25% lowered resistance, which means it could go below 0 into the negatives. For example, if an enemy has 10% resistance, with the gem their resistance is treated as -15%. Or am I completely misunderstanding this?

I ask because my current build relies almost entirely on lightning, and my best bet for highly resistant mobs is a combination of curses, Elemental Equilibrium and this support gem. The first two actually state specifically that they lower resistance, so if it is hitting negative values already, is this support gem being wasted?

we don't know exactly how much res a monster has, but they suffer same effective working cap that players do of 75%. a patch mentioned that monsters can have more res than that just like players can while still capped. that makes it so that curses or this sort of support gem will have less effect, but still do something.

what these penetration gems do is how you understand from other games as "reduced", penetrate from other games is indeed "ignore X amount of target stat". in this game there simply isn't anything that does that (except chaos but thats 100% ignoring of energy shield and defenses) so the word can be interchangeable for the moment.

resistances can go below 0 in this game specially for players or no resist mobs. so yes your understanding is correct that if a mob has 10% res, it'll then have -15%.

i'm not certain but i can safely guess that non magic, non rare, and non mage skeleton based mobs that have a resistance, has 25% res per difficulty so 100% at merciless (still only 75% "works"). i'm waiting patently for a dev to respond otherwise but it make sense because normal mode and ruth mobs take moderate damage from things they are resistant to, but noticibly less than something they are not resistant to. the all resist mobs mentioned seem to have 75% res on all difficulties, i cannot test correctly on what resistance lowering effects do to them.

Thanks. This means my oddball strategy of stacking -Resist will actually work better than I thought. Whether or not it works at higher difficulties is yet to be seen.


But even now, Conductivity and Lightning Pen combined are reducing something like 65% resistance. Getting EE and Elemental Weakness would bring that down to something ridiculous. Hell, level 1 of all those gems combined with EE brings it down by 110% already. 135% if I can do the double-proc on EE.

Has anyone happened to notice that the level 8 version of the gem has a higher experience requirement than the level 9 version? Level 8 requires 1,016,533 experience to get to level 9, Level 9 requires only 860,401 to get to level 10. Seems like it should be reversed.