BG3 and PoE - PoE2 best of both games?

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I'm an old SNES gamer that grew up playing Chrono Trigger where RNG was basically inexistent,

Works for kids only.
Very young ones can watch the same cartoon for like 10 times a day easily )
Same with computer games.

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Azimuthus#1135 wrote:

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I'm an old SNES gamer that grew up playing Chrono Trigger where RNG was basically inexistent,

Works for kids only.
Very young ones can watch the same cartoon for like 10 times a day easily )
Same with computer games.

Being for "kids only" don't invalidate the longevity of the game and its replayability. Otherwise Chrono Trigger wouldn't be one the most beloved JRPG ever made.

The point is, RNG doesn't make a game enjoyable to replay. Games like Super Metroid, Dragon Ages: Origins, Hollow Knight, Elden Ring and some others with zero or few RNG are replayable to exhaustion without becomes boring.

RNG is compatible with a more in depth campaign though, I think that's a moot point. Maps, monsters, loot, random encounters and quests, crafting etc can all be RNG and are expected in an arpg. The RNG and dialogue/class choices where you alter the outcome makes it even more replayable.

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Azimuthus#1135 wrote:

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From what I get, certain people do play BG3 again and again simply because of RP element. Literally. They want to dive in the world and live there with their char. Aside from that there is not too much replayability. Combat is nice, and you can replay 1-2 times max with very different setups, but there is no randomization in enemies/position/gear and it becomes boring.

BG3 peak 875k and 24hr peak 96k a year after release. that's pretty good for a game that doesn't have seasonal resets and new content all the time. combine that with a league reset and I think it's a winner for GGG

Since the dawn of video games I have hated turn-based combat in games, but I bought BG3 anyway because several friends told me I wouldn't regret it.

Boy, they were right. Quite possibly the best RPG I have ever played. I've done 6 or 7 playthroughs now and I have never once been bored. There's just so much diversity and consequences for the choices you make. You could do a playthrough as a devout Paladin do-gooder and a second playthrough as an evil Sorcerer, and it'll be an entirely different experience. Multiply that example times 50 and you've got BG3. It's just a masterpiece.

It's a real shame that gaming studios have drifted away from the type of passion and effort that went into making BG3. Nowadays it's all about money and not much else.

I too would be happy if GGG spent 4 years in EA to produce something on par, but I doubt they will. PoE 2 will probably align more closely with how Diablo 4 launched. Unpolished and unashamed so long as the MTX get sold.

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Azimuthus#1135 wrote:

From what I get, certain people do play BG3 again and again simply because of RP element. Literally. They want to dive in the world and live there with their char. Aside from that there is not too much replayability. Combat is nice, and you can replay 1-2 times max with very different setups, but there is no randomization in enemies/position/gear and it becomes boring.

Replayability comes only with RNG. The more RNG game offers, the more replayable it is.

There's an insane amount of RNG in BG3. Literally everything is a roll of the dice. Whether you can decipher something in the terrain, open a door or pass a dialogue check all depends on RNG, and unless you're save scumming these things all have massive implications on the story, character outcomes and dialogue.

Couple this with the roleplaying aspects possible through dialogue and your actions within the game and you have a limitless amount of replayability. I've already played through 6 or 7 timnes and I enjoyed every time through as much as the first.

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Blasphemous84#2190 wrote:

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Azimuthus#1135 wrote:

From what I get, certain people do play BG3 again and again simply because of RP element. Literally. They want to dive in the world and live there with their char. Aside from that there is not too much replayability. Combat is nice, and you can replay 1-2 times max with very different setups, but there is no randomization in enemies/position/gear and it becomes boring.

Replayability comes only with RNG. The more RNG game offers, the more replayable it is.

There's an insane amount of RNG in BG3. Literally everything is a roll of the dice. Whether you can decipher something in the terrain, open a door or pass a dialogue check all depends on RNG, and unless you're save scumming these things all have massive implications on the story, character outcomes and dialogue.

Couple this with the roleplaying aspects possible through dialogue and your actions within the game and you have a limitless amount of replayability. I've already played through 6 or 7 timnes and I enjoyed every time through as much as the first.

Couple the "DnD RNG" with mods and you get a game you can replay over and over if you like. Randomize item locations or even enemies, everything possible.

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There's an insane amount of RNG in BG3. Literally everything is a roll of the dice. Whether you can decipher something in the terrain, open a door or pass a dialogue check all depends on RNG, and unless you're save scumming these things all have massive implications on the story, character outcomes and dialogue.

I was talking about meaningful RNG. Dice with different dialogue outcomes or combat rolls is not meaningful RNG for me (can't make me to play this game again).

Level layouts RNG or different unpredicted enemies or good unpredicted enemy AI is a good type of RNG. Like in XCOM2 for example. And in ARPGS it is loot, ofc - smth BG3 does not have at all.

I guess you missed the complete mess BG3 was for around a year after release.

Game breaking and immersion breaking bugs. It's not like they weren't told about some of the bugs either. I code both Divinity OS2 and BG3. Larian was told about quite a few bugs in their engine years ago and they didn't fix it. Specifically Boost effect double dipping.

Which is why they ended up with problems like this:
https://i.imgur.com/uzO1rqi.png - A bug reported from DOS2.

They didn't fix the way aura statuses work and oh man. I could go on a long time since I've been doing it for 5 years now. Far as the different Acts. That's a Larian staple at this point. Act 1 kinda short, Act 2 usually the best, Act 3 bloated because it's filled with all the stuff they finished for other parts of the game they didn't make. While Sven tries to imply blame on WoTC which is probably partially true. I know from experience that Larian is slow and kinda lazy.
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After that bit of a vent. I wouldn't code larian games if I didn't care. Comparing an ARPG to CRPG isn't that far fetched either since ARPGs came from CRPGs. I also agree what ARPGs lack these days is the RPG part. We're also talking about notably different company size and money. Larian had to kickstarter Divinity OS2 they have 475 employees to GGG's 4k.

PoE2 has no excuse to be in the terrible shape it's in with such poor designs. Not to mention over 2 months in and nothing meaningful has changed. I'm buying Divinity 3 soon as it's out. I'm not giving GGG another dime till I see real changes. The state of PoE2 is inexcusable.

That's like comparing Pac Man to Tetris.. ^^