Simple solution to the One Death mechanic that is clearly hated by most players

I was very frustrated initially as well but I think it is fine as it is.

The game doesnt hand hold you, with experience you'll find level difference is the single biggest contributor to survivability and so the lack of easing into the maps currently - as the devs said - is what contributes to make the experience frustrating.

Also imho since 0.1.1 it got a lot better. Better visuals for rare mods, less damage spikes from trash mobs, in my experience. The rest unfortunately you learn by experience.

"

AliquamGames#5952 wrote:

"

Hardcaliber19#6651 wrote:

"

BedlessSleeper#0856 wrote:

But I like it how it is.

Yes, there is a vocal minority that seems to enjoy this. That is a minority opinion. Unless you want to be playing this game with a drastically reduced player base, then this approach will have to change.

I guarantee you GGG wants to have a successful game with good player retention. This is a surefire way to make that much more difficult, and turn this into just another niche arpg. Seems like bad business to me.

Sorry sweetie, but the general consensus in the playerbase is that we want one death per map. I know you vocal minority folks want to have own way but the majority has decided.

Says the Vocal Minority, pretending to claim it's the Majority.

When you lose half your player base in a WEEK of release, you need to check the reason why.

But GGG doesn't care, never have.

"

CovidPatientZero#0332 wrote:

What's the obsession with overgeneralizing and strawmaning people who have legitimate complaints? Someone saying the death penalties are too punishing is met with "you don't want a challenge. Go back to D4. You have a trash build"

No, people do want a challenge. The first 3 acts were a perfect example of a good challenge that forced you to gear up and use passives properly while not being overly punishing. The core mechanics of the endgame are just flawed and don't actually offer a fun challenge, it's just a screen clearing and boss melting race.

It's because it's never "I have a legitimate complaint that I am about to state as my opinion"

It's "I just died due to my own mistake in the game and came here to throw a tantrum, claim all my opinions as fact with zero data, claim everyone agrees with me with zero proof, claim I know the answer to everything while providing no ACTUAL feedback, just rage."

Over and over and over, and there are plenty of posts NOT like that, and they get absolutely SMOTHERED by the shitstorm of babyrage posts.

"

FruitLord#0833 wrote:

I think keep the XP loss, keep the one death loses waystone. But the node remains the same. Still has mechanics(boss/breach/delirium) and the player can craft a new waystone that is easier. Lower tier, less mods, whatever.

Citadels being lost...well, I'm conflicted on that. I think they should be different from other nodes so having just the one attempt is ok. Maybe allow more deaths like arbiter? Or continue fixing unfair one-shots.

Doesn't work because you could just spam farm that node by dying, like farming breaches and rituals.

"

dwqrf#0717 wrote:

"

Hardcaliber19#6651 wrote:

"

BedlessSleeper#0856 wrote:

But I like it how it is.

Yes, there is a vocal minority that seems to enjoy this. That is a minority opinion. Unless you want to be playing this game with a drastically reduced player base, then this approach will have to change.

I guarantee you GGG wants to have a successful game with good player retention. This is a surefire way to make that much more difficult, and turn this into just another niche arpg. Seems like bad business to me.

No, the minority are the people complaining about it. That's the human nature. It's called a vocal minority.

The silent majority ? They are playing the as is and don't complain about it. And if they really dislike it ? They move on and play something else while still accepting that PoE2 is what it is, with its rules and designs, and that's not a game for them.

This. I like how it is, and I do not start posts like "It is good. Leave it as is." or anything similar.

"

Redthorne82#3177 wrote:

"

CovidPatientZero#0332 wrote:

What's the obsession with overgeneralizing and strawmaning people who have legitimate complaints? Someone saying the death penalties are too punishing is met with "you don't want a challenge. Go back to D4. You have a trash build"

No, people do want a challenge. The first 3 acts were a perfect example of a good challenge that forced you to gear up and use passives properly while not being overly punishing. The core mechanics of the endgame are just flawed and don't actually offer a fun challenge, it's just a screen clearing and boss melting race.

It's because it's never "I have a legitimate complaint that I am about to state as my opinion"

It's "I just died due to my own mistake in the game and came here to throw a tantrum, claim all my opinions as fact with zero data, claim everyone agrees with me with zero proof, claim I know the answer to everything while providing no ACTUAL feedback, just rage."

Over and over and over, and there are plenty of posts NOT like that, and they get absolutely SMOTHERED by the shitstorm of babyrage posts.

I've seen plenty of legitimate complaints met with "get good" "your build is trash" "POE2 doesn't hold your hand".

One thing I have noticed is there were a lot less complaints regarding Acts 1-3, which offered a good challenge that didn't kick you while you're down. Maybe you should ask yourself why that is

"

CovidPatientZero#0332 wrote:

What's the obsession with overgeneralizing and strawmaning people who have legitimate complaints? Someone saying the death penalties are too punishing is met with "you don't want a challenge. Go back to D4. You have a trash build"

No, people do want a challenge. The first 3 acts were a perfect example of a good challenge that forced you to gear up and use passives properly while not being overly punishing. The core mechanics of the endgame are just flawed and don't actually offer a fun challenge, it's just a screen clearing and boss melting race.

But that's literally what mapping is. Its a screen clearing endgame where your main focus is wiping the map as efficient as possible, killing map bosses relatively quickly, with citadel bosses being a higher challenge.

If you don't want that, theres literally Sekhemas and Ultimatum. If you don't like any of these, then it literally just means the game in its current state isn't for you. Thats all.

"

BedlessSleeper#0856 wrote:

"

FruitLord#0833 wrote:

I think keep the XP loss, keep the one death loses waystone. But the node remains the same. Still has mechanics(boss/breach/delirium) and the player can craft a new waystone that is easier. Lower tier, less mods, whatever.

Citadels being lost...well, I'm conflicted on that. I think they should be different from other nodes so having just the one attempt is ok. Maybe allow more deaths like arbiter? Or continue fixing unfair one-shots.

Doesn't work because you could just spam farm that node by dying, like farming breaches and rituals.

Yep. That's not the solution. That is exactly what they want to avoid.

The solution is right in front of their face. The portals are already there. Just let players use them. Costs you a portal when you die. So 3 tries, assuming you don't go back to hideout for any other reason. No respawning mobs or mechanics. You run out of portals, then the waystone and map node are bricked. I do not understand why this is complicated, or controversial at all.

I have yet to hear a cogent argument for why one-strike-and-you're-out is good. In this thread, in any other thread or forum, or even from Jonathan/GGG. If you can't explain why the mechanic is good, except for how you "feel"... it is not good game design.

I don't have a problem with the challenge, and I don't think hand holding is necessary. For me, it's just a clunky and un-fun experience to have to sit around and wait for people to finish a map when it's multi player. I can accept that I have f'ed up and I need a better build or to get better at a particular challenge. Ive ran into a couple where i beat my head against the wall until i finally took a break and said "im clearly doing something wrong here."

I CAN control that. What I cant control is "sweet, i was hard rolling this level, but the enemy just spawned on top of me during a ritual challenge and one shot me so now I guess I sit here for another 20 minutes while i wait for my team members to finish or go do another map by myself." it's clunky and makes the game frustrating for multiplayer.

I don't know if there is a good answer. I get that it needs to be a challenge and I get that things happen and you cant always control the narrative... but i think for the long term health of the game and wide spread appeal, no right minded non hardcore player is going to tolerate being locked out of a mission, player skill be damned.

"

BedlessSleeper#0856 wrote:

"

CovidPatientZero#0332 wrote:

What's the obsession with overgeneralizing and strawmaning people who have legitimate complaints? Someone saying the death penalties are too punishing is met with "you don't want a challenge. Go back to D4. You have a trash build"

No, people do want a challenge. The first 3 acts were a perfect example of a good challenge that forced you to gear up and use passives properly while not being overly punishing. The core mechanics of the endgame are just flawed and don't actually offer a fun challenge, it's just a screen clearing and boss melting race.

But that's literally what mapping is. Its a screen clearing endgame where your main focus is wiping the map as efficient as possible, killing map bosses relatively quickly, with citadel bosses being a higher challenge.

If you don't want that, theres literally Sekhemas and Ultimatum. If you don't like any of these, then it literally just means the game in its current state isn't for you. Thats all.

That's not the game GGG advertised and not the game the campaign set players up for. That's where the frustration comes from. If that's what mapping is, then a lot of people are going to decide it's not the game for them. If I wanted that I can just play D4.