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I am not talking about selling those map mods. The div price in chaos is driven by map rerolling right now and mods like that would amplify that effect was just what i meant. I run all my maps and don't pay attention to possible sales unless it#s an 8 mod corrupted i cannot run. Don't have time to look out for 3 div sales for t17s, they are quite rare anyway if you don't spam hundreds of chaos. I spend like 10-20 chaos per map, no big deal...but certainly not more

poe as a whole feels terrible to play

I hope they get rid of all this zoom zoom braindead nonsense

Man, again....posts that ignore the reality of the game.

"Think of the fun you could have if <haste shrine> was applied for the whole map"

These types of lottery wins already exist in basically every mechanic you find within the map. We don't need ANOTHER lottery system on top of that which acts contrary to the entire system its being added into.

Having a temporary "boost" like that would not make mapping feel any better. It might make THAT map feel great the first few times you roll it......but then what about every OTHER map that comes next? All the maps that DON'T have that same positive effect now feel far far far worse by comparison.

Map mods being inherently "negative" (while increasing loot), keeps the feeling balanced across every single map you run. Running specific content within the maps is where you get varying degrees of "Awesome" moments: getting that divine altar, getting that monster drop, getting that item you've been targeting, etc. With map mods, you can always count on the fact that more mods = more loot. Harder mods = more loot. That is what drives future mapping.

OP wants to separate map "feeling" from map reward which I have to say again is IMPOSSIBLE in Path of Exile. If there exists a positive map mod, there would have to be a negative loot modifier to pair it with. If this didn't happen, then the positive map mods would just make all other maps pure garbage. Resulting in exactly the same scenario OP describes as being "terrible" right now, except on the opposite side of the spectrum.

Why do we run maps? What is the fundamental reason we take a character and decide to run that next hardest map, or run our 10th t17 map? Fun plays a role, but ultimately it is about the loot. It is ALWAYS about the loot. No one in there right mind is going to run a "You are affected by a haste shrine" map over a different map if it offers significantly less loot. It just won't happen. If that were true, we would have plenty of people hanging out in maps well below their strength level, playing because they are "overpowered" for that encounter.

That "feeling" of dominating or being stronger than the risk already exists everywhere. Which is why it is NOT needed within map modifiers.



Here's my contribution directly to the "title" of the thread, since OP seems to not want anyone to take any of his actual words into account when replying:

If you feel that mapping "feels terrible" in current PoE, it will ALWAYS feel terrible even if you were to add "positive" mods to the modpool. Your issue is not the mods: it is the MAPPING itself. And that will not change. This whole idea of adding "positive" modifiers to the pool is a smokescreen, a poorly thought out smokescreen, for the real criticism. Just look at the OP's comparisons and you can see that: 1) blighted maps, a completely different mechanic and map experience. 2) a completely different GAME, Grim Dawn. Whose mutators, btw, do NOT affect loot resulting in a COMPLETELY different system!


I fail to see the answer to this question anywhere: WHY would adding positive modifiers make mapping better?
"Because FUN" isn't a respectable answer, its subjective and offers nothing of meaning.

Ex: I personally HATE running blighted maps. Hate it with a passion. It can have the most positive mods it wants to have, but that will never make me run them. Because the MECHANIC is what I despise. BUT....if you correspondingly make the reward of running it rather huge, then that would at least make me consider doing it. Reward MUST be a part of the conversation

I would also ask this of the OP, because he failed to answer it in his first post (yet showed his hand in the title):

Why do YOU hate mapping, or more accurately, t17s?

Because the only real answer I can find is that they are too hard, and he wants them to be easier.

^and you continue to fail to realize that, you can't have a meaningful discussion about this idea of yours....without talking about loot.

Also....every single reply to you has been about loot, or it has contributed nothing lol. Except yours because you are "trying" to separate loot from the discussion, when it is inextricably intertwined.

You are right, you will get nowhere with me. And your thread will get nowhere else because you fail to recognize that ignoring a very real connection makes it incredibly difficult to discuss something in earnest.

To discuss the positives and negatives within a system, you must have an understanding of the system which you are trying to change. OR you must discuss and develop an entirely new system from the ground up.


Analogy Time: its like someone decides that it would be better for a Guitar to have 5 strings instead of 6 because you either can or you can't play the guitar, but asking us to ignore the range of notes or chords that can be played with 6 strings and how that would necessarily change. While also ignoring the fact that Ukuleles and other guitar-like instruments exist with less than 6 strings already.

Map mods were never supposed to make the map easier, why are you even complaining.

"

KaFeuk wrote:

Map mods were never supposed to make the map easier, why are you even complaining.

Hehe I already explained that too...and it was ignored. Because it has to do with LOOT, the forbidden word!

"But it works in other games!" -again....because LOOT.


Totally different system, intertwined with loot in ways that other games do NOT have.

Every map modifier adds IIQ/IIR and packsize based on its conceived difficulty. You bring up map modifiers, so people bring up loot in response.

I agree, --- indeed.

That's certainly one way to end a discussion.....but it doesn't look too good for any future posts! Will definitely remember this one

It's a shame because a real conversation could have been had....[Removed by Support]


"Many are stubborn in pursuit of the path they have chosen; few in pursuit of the goal" - Nietzsche