PSA: All the PoE2 Footage You've Seen is from the Equivalent of Acts 1~3

Not sure why it is needed to run in circle around the main issue: POE2 will start with low range and low rate of skills and then will get the same "powercreep" than POE1. Like I posted a month or so ago: it will follow the same path... But two times faster.

The secondary aspect being gameplay, which this time is vastly influenced by CONSOLES (= GAMEPADS) and LARGER AUDIENCE (= YOUR OWN CONCLUSION).

If PoE2 becomes as deep and complex as PoE1 in terms of customization, character building, and crafting, in addition to offering new, engaging, and methodical combat, it has the potential to become a true masterpiece. However, I'm afraid GGG will deliberately sacrifice depth and complexity to make it more palatable for new players, especially console players who won't use third-party software like PoB, which is so ingrained in Poe1 and makes up a good portion of its gaming experience. Controllers could also limit the design space of the developers in creating new skills and boss encounters. I really want to be wrong here, but I can't stop thinking this game will never be what it could've been.

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Phrazz wrote:

You talk as if finding equilibrium is supposed to be easier to achieve after "MANY years". I beg to differ, and I think the easiest way to balance the game, is to start over - like they are doing. Making 36 ascendancies from scratch and balancing them in a new environment will probably be A LOT easier than trying to balance anything in PoE 1, where there are so many moving parts, so many multipliers and so many unforseen hurdles.

The butterfly effect is real in PoE. Changing a minor trifle in one corner, can make the smallest man OP. There are hundreds, if not thousands of unique items, notables, key stones, skills and support gems just waiting for a single little mechanical addition to becomes the greates thing since sliced bread.

PoE 1 is just... Too much... It cannot be balanced.

If GGG is going to use the current model of 3-4 leeagues per year, they will hve to start POE2 very lean on content. They will need room to add all the new (or revised old) content back into the game. Since we are getting all six acts, Act expansion is unlikely in the first few leagues.

Content wise I would expect not much beyond getting to Act 6 and then a basic endgame. this will give them opportunity keep fixing basics after the beta. In each of the next few leagues they will add more and perhaps bring back revised popular POE1 content.

Will the passive tree be smaller at the beginning? I hope so. I also hope there is still an Atlas tree. They must leave space future content and balance the additions in each new league.

CB: fair enough, old man. :p

I feel for you re the wasd/driving change but it is what it is. It is not even the future of ARPGs -- it's probably already the present of them.

Ps why are so many of my fave peeps on here older than me? I'm no spring chicken and it's not like anyone "acts their age" on here. Something about age and wisdom and all that I guess...

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Lol at calling DS44 "Darth". Episode IV flashbacks. I dig.

This thread blew up and in a really good way. Yay. Time to catch up read.

Phrazz: butterfly effect? No. That to me implies a sort of mystic causality separated by oceanic distance. We know it's not that. It's a web. Twang one thread and the whole thing can tremble. Similar metaphor but more visually appropriate given the Skilldrasil. Which, to be fair, is less a tree now than an insanely complex root system. Ah fuck too many metaphors.

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Foreverhappychan wrote:

Phrazz: butterfly effect? No. That to me implies a sort of mystic causality separated by oceanic distance. We know it's not that. It's a web. Twang one thread and the whole thing can tremble. Similar metaphor but more visually appropriate given the Skilldrasil. Which, to be fair, is less a tree now than an insanely complex root system. Ah fuck too many metaphors.

Fair enough, I guess. The point still stands, though: Finding equilibrium in power and at the same time push out powerful mechanics is an impossible task in a game with so many moving parts and... Deep roots? And big webs? :P

There are so many unique items and notables that set a ceiling for what they can do with new content. Ignore one line on one item and we have WWIII on the forums because something is "broken".

PoE 2 gives them a chance to set new tags, new rules and new... Ceilings. Which they will definitely stretch as far as they can as time goes by, just like PoE 1. But in the first year(s), it should be possible to maintain somewhat of an equilibrium when it comes to power balance.

But now it's time to test out the new Enshrouded update.

Some people might not combo moves but there are a couple of ARPGs I can name which did skill combos in a fun and easily enjoyable way.

1. Blade & Sword: An old indie arpg nobody played. Still fun, decent music and TRU MELEE.
2. Sacred 2

You basically have a combo 'skill' and then you slot in skills that you want to use in combination. So you just press the combo skill and the slotted skills will be sequentially cast. EzPz.

Oh, I do remember that about Sacred 2. Combo creation was really cool. Basically served like a macro in an MMO.

https://www.sacredwiki.org/index.php/Sacred_2:Combo

I especially loved how it showed the cooldown for the entire combo based on its slowest component. Nice QoL that.

Somehow I forgot about it because I took it for granted, that combo system. And yet I'll never forget the skill upgrade system because at least a few that came after kind of copied it. Technically PoE 2 copies it, except instead of choosing base skill upgrades per tier, you equip them directly to the skill gem itself.

A tried and true method but given a GGG twist. And isn't that approach what made PoE itself so special? FFVII but with a GGG twist. FFX but with a GGG twist. Guild Wars 1 but with a GGG twist...

There are worse systems to twist than Sacred 2's skill style. Man now I REALLY want to see an evolved version of that combo button. Good for RSI*, good for deeps. Everyone wins.



huh, Blade&Sword looks fascinating but oh that's a rough as guts localisation.

Here are some of my 'tru melee' memories from bygone eras: Bushido Blade, Severance: Blade of Darkness, Vagrant Story, Budokan, Weaponlord, Golden Axe, King of Dragons, Jedi Academy (really), and I suppose Soul Edge gets a mention despite Cervantes bringing a gun to a sword fight. More recently, Stranger of Paradise had some of the most satisfying melee I've played in ages. But for ARPGs? Not a one. Diablo 1? Tank mage baby. Diablo 2? Bone Spear spammer. Sacred 2? Uh, my melee character fired beams from her swords. Torchlight? Was all about ember blasts. PoE? Best and most beloved character I ever made was a trapper abusing vaal fireball shotguns. I like to PLAY melee in ARPGs, but at no point did I ever allow myself to believe that it was me being smart or optimal. It was always...always doofing around to some degree, which meant, yeah, I spent 4k to create doof-around weapons in PoE. Totally worth it.

Hey, one of those doof-around melee weapons was super helpful when I was leveling my Animate Weapon of Self Reflection build this league. Goddess Bound slaughterfukt the wretched hordes of Wraeclast in murder-ghost form for quite a bit of the leveling process.

...hey. It occurs to me - Animate Weapon of Self Reflection uses a hard/sharp thing to strike one enemy one time. No AoE explosions, no blade beams, no projectiles - just a melee weapon striking a single enemy to deal damage (unless you Melee Splash, but hey).

...that means AWoSR is clearly TRU MELEE, and my AWoSR Necromancer is a TRU MELEE character. Victory for Rae.

So I might just steal slaughterfucked.

:)

I used to get so butthurt when people used my weapons for shit like Spectral Throw but eh at least they used them. Plenty of supporter uniques never had their time in the sun and that *still* makes me a little butthurt.

Also I can't deny that spectral projections of OG look kinda fucking rad.

But no, that aint trve melee. Gotta be holding the thing for that. Animate weapon is a pet. The pet might melee but for the owner it is technically a ranged weapon

Sorry. No gold star for you.

Oh I know, it just amuses me to occasionally throw additional shade on all the goobers who still think Heavy Strike should be the game's only premier skill.

What's extra funny to me is people constantly carping on PoE2's skill system because "I HATE COMBOS LEMME ONE-BUTTON MY ENEMIES!!"...when the dev team has said that combo gameplay and skills having distinct jobs again rather than every skill being expected to be an omnicompetent One-Button Wonder is what will allow them to make AoE damage much weaker and buff single-target-only garbage like Heavy Strike to the point where slapping one enemy one time with one weapon might actually be halfway viable. Just not in EVERY fight.

All the TRU MELEE goobers who want to stand toe to toe with giant bosses and hit them with an axe until they fall over? PoE2 is designed in such a way that they can do that better. Buuuuut, nah. Gotta be able to do it without having to dodge enemies or engage in boss skills/mechanics, and gotta be able to do it just as easily against a pack of fifty porcupines as against a single boss.

Bleh.