Why was the divination card reward structure changed?

You seem to be under the impression that I aim for pure bossing to be a more profitable strategy than it already is above all else, my primary point is that there is no reason to run bosses unless you are running 100+. That is stupid, furthermore the fact that nimis is 90 divs this league means that it is out of reach of the vast majority of players, if you sell 1 nimis for 90 divs when you drop 3 or 30 nimises for 9 divs when you drop 30, you make a lot more when you sell 30 of them. We have swung too far onto limited supply and that is secondary to my point of bosses not being worth killing for most people even when you can do ubers because its a gamble with terrible odds. You are literally more likely to win out by selling those invitations and buying an apothecary and then gambling until its either gone or an MB which is incredibly stupid.

^and you STILL don't get that this particular change in cards HELPS with your "primary point".

You keep saying, over and over again, that bosses are "not worth doing" because you need to run them too many times to earn a profit.

The BEST way to tackle that issue head-on is to INCREASE the value of whatever might drop from that boss. That is exactly what GGG did.

The SECOND thing is playing with drop rates, but it should ALWAYS be a lengthy grind. Think about how long it takes a good bosser to clear a boss: maybe 1 minute? Maybe less? Even 1 out of 100 drop rate is hardly ANY time in the grand scheme of a 3-4 month league.

So what if nimis is 90 divine? I can guarantee you that someone will buy that nimis almost instantly if its priced correctly. That's the whole point. The price-point it currently is at is determined BOTH by what sellers put it up for AND what buyers are willing to pay. If they weren't selling, the price would be lower. In fact, if you set up a live search and watch nimis for an hour, you'll see how quick the turnaround is from list to sale.

You seem to fundamentally not understand how market mechanics work, and you also seem to not understand where your OWN feelings are coming into play here...you have made it abundantly clear that you dislike grinding, especially grinding bosses. I don't really think anything GGG does is going to change this for you. They could make the best boss item be a guaranteed drop but you know what would happen? The frag value and the drop value would plummet to such a cheap price that you would STILL have to grind LONGER to accumulate the equivalent amount of wealth.

You seem to be under the impression that farming nimis or ashes or omni is a lengthy grind, talk to an ssf player about farming ashes, previously it was doable but something that you would spend weeks on, now doing so is something liable to take the entire league to achieve. You seem to be under the impression that drop rates are currently reasonable, they are not it is a bandaid intended to force trading but functionally results in bossing being a massive gamble, you spend a 1 div on the uber fragments and every 50 or so times you make your money back and maybe a little bit more, but butween those you functionally make nothing at all, that is not a reasonable grind that is ridiculous.

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jsuslak313 wrote:

^and you STILL don't get that this particular change in cards HELPS with your "primary point".

You keep saying, over and over again, that bosses are "not worth doing" because you need to run them too many times to earn a profit.

The BEST way to tackle that issue head-on is to INCREASE the value of whatever might drop from that boss. That is exactly what GGG did.

But... most pinnacle-specific stuff is priced LOWER than they were in affliction...

Voidforge is priced at 40 and in affli, they were at 60, starforge was priced at 10 on afli and they are currently at 8... the only boss-specific thing that have a better price now is dying sun, and that can be explained by it being a regular-shaper specific drop now(meaning you can only drop it by farming the non-uber version of the boss wich is a significant compromise)

Keep in mind, affliction pushed players away from bossing and that drove the price up, yes, BUT importantly to your point, they made players engage in regular content where the cards and stacked decks for boss-specific stuff were(especially on starforge)

Cards dont have that much of an impact on price for pinnacle drops because i think anyone with some experience with stacked decks gamble can tell that those cards were friggin hard to get. Endless darkness cards are found in a area of rather dubious profitability, greatest intentions is found on an area that is a pain to acess and the world eater card is probably strong case of how little the cards impact the price of items, everyone and their dog was going for beyond on affliction and the price of starforge STILL didnt drop in the chaos-realm despite people going ham on the content where the card is(was)

Just how many stacked decks you have to open to complete a full set of either of these 3 cards? My personal xp tells deep 5-digits of decks, i literally got more house of mirrors than i have full sets of those on my deck-gambling

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feike wrote:

But... most pinnacle-specific stuff is priced LOWER than they were in affliction...

That is simply because affli shat out divines all over the place. The individual divine held less buying power. That's what's known as "inflation". Devaluing of the currency itself, not the item. A single divine in affliction held a FRACTION of the buying power that it currently holds. That's why the same box of cereal at the store this year costs a dollar more than what it cost last year: the VALUE of that box of cereal didn't change at all, but the value of your currency did. Lower value currency = higher prices.

Again...misunderstanding how the market works.

We all seem to be arguing past each other because we all seem to have very different ideas of what bossing should be like, you seem to believe that requiring 100+ runs of a specific boss to do better than break even is a good thing even though it vastly disincentivizes people running those bosses unless it is literally all they do, I am of the opinion that it would be vastly better for the game to operate in a manner where you are incentivized to run all the bosses you can, where they drop their loot regularly enough that it is not constantly a gamble with vastly worse odds than trying to gamble to a mageblood. As I have said before if you are running fewer than 50 to 100 of a given boss you are more likely to actually profit by trying to gamble an apoth to an MB (1 in 5 odds vs 1 in 50) when bosses are among the most interesting parts of the game, I just cannot justify running them in a trade environment when I need to farm currency for key pieces of my builds.

If the rate of payout was something remotely reasonable it would be justifiable, that is the major complaint, that for the average player the sum total of their bossing experience is 1 eater, exarch and maven for voidstones and maybe doing the other favored map bosses and either farming or buying the uber elder fragments for their last voidstone and then never again, just selling the fragments and invitations. That is terrible from the perspective of people actually engaging with the gameplay instead of just blasting maps. There seems to be this disconnect where you automatically assume anyone who thinks that items should less obnoxiously rare drops does not understand the genre, no the issue is that they have swung ridiculously far around into incentivizing people to not engage with the majority of the endgame mechanics because its a super low odds gamble that you will make anything from it instead of just losing money.

^no....that is all you arguing that.

The only thing related to "boss grind" length I ever said was it is a GOOD thing to have a long grind. Never once did i put any numbers on that, it was all you. You are arguing with yourself because you aren't comprehending or reading anything I write in response.

That is why every one of your posts keeps saying the same thing.

I did say at one point "even IF it were 1/100, that is still a negligible amount of time". And it is. Think about how many maps you run in a given league. How many delve floors you traverse. How many essences you pop. Any grind. 100 is a pittance. It is a single gaming session.

If YOU find it fun, then it doesn't matter how many times it takes. If you don't find it fun, there's a million other things to do.


IT is 100% reasonable that, after 2-3 hours of gameplay, you end up with 50+ divines from a boss drop. Consider that normal mapping wouldn't net you anywhere CLOSE to that amount in the same amount of time, unless you are leveraging some other farming strategy which.....likely will take you the same amount of time.

[Removed by Support]

1 in 100 droprate from boss items should be prestige items like mageblood not build enablers like nimis and ashes and omni. If your build is reliant on mageblood to function then your build is absolute garbage and you are getting carried by MB, if your build relies on nimis or ashes or omni to function, that's how that archetype of build works to begin with. MB is more than anything a ridiculous pile of raw bonus stats and utility it does not fundamentally change the way your skills or character behave the way the build enabling boss drops that are now all gated behind ubers do and your belief that those enablers should be as rare as MB is stupid and would strangle build diversity even worse than it already has been.

Since support apparently is in the habit of deleting entire paragraphs instead of single sentences I will return the statement as to your belief that 100 ubers is a single gaming session. No it is not, it is more ubers than most people who do regularly run bosses will face in a league, it requires buying boss fragments or invitations en mass and either having a build that skips phases or just flat out no lifing the game for 8+ hour sessions at a time dedicated wholly to bossing. Most players can run 2 to 3 thousand maps in a league without too much difficulty, running more than 20 of a given boss requires either playing like you stream PoE for a living or buying the fragments. Most players would be incredibly lucky to see an FFF drop much less an ashes or an omni or an uber exclusive like nimis or prog. I did run 40 maven invitations as ubers between 3.22 and 3.23 and I got a grand total of 40 elevated sextants 30 something orbs of conflict and a bunch of popcorn uniques worth 20 to 30 c at most, that is not reasonable payout that is me basically lighting currency on fire because I enjoy beating up ubers.

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Angrybagel wrote:

If the crazy decisions made for this league's update are because of the "vision" that led to POE-2, maybe I should just take my money somewhere else. Even without the league mechanic mucking things up, it feels like a different game now...and not for the better.

Agree

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Angrybagel wrote:

If the crazy decisions made for this league's update are because of the "vision" that led to POE-2, maybe I should just take my money somewhere else. Even without the league mechanic mucking things up, it feels like a different game now...and not for the better.

like they sayd "deal with it" no money for ggg "deal with it" that all.