ExileCon Put My Support Into a Conflicted Place

Isn't it interesting that, where many of us criticize GGG for recent recent decisions, it is we who are criticized, even excoriated for not just sucking it up? PoE 1 is slammed because of the "zoom-zoom" playstyle which many (but not all) players have adopted, and PoE 2, as a separate game, is lauded as the solution. Who created the systems which made that possible, and encouraged them with timed-event mechanics?

If PoE 1 is broken beyond redemption, that's GGG's fault, not ours. All my anger and resentment is directed where I see the problems originating, not at my fellow exiles, even those who pour some truly vituperative attacks on those of us who speak out about our grievances as if they have no merit.

It's one thing if you don't agree, if you don't see things as some of us do; it's quite another to cast aspersions and ad hominem attacks at us because we perceive this situation in a way you apparently cannot.

And we're the ones who are being "childish." =9[.]9=

"

Raycheetah wrote:

Isn't it interesting that, where many of us criticize GGG for recent recent decisions, it is we who are criticized, even excoriated for not just sucking it up? PoE 1 is slammed because of the "zoom-zoom" playstyle which many (but not all) players have adopted, and PoE 2, as a separate game, is lauded as the solution. Who created the systems which made that possible, and encouraged them with timed-event mechanics?

If PoE 1 is broken beyond redemption, that's GGG's fault, not ours. All my anger and resentment is directed where I see the problems originating, not at my fellow exiles, even those who pour some truly vituperative attacks on those of us who speak out about our grievances as if they have no merit.

It's one thing if you don't agree, if you don't see things as some of us do; it's quite another to cast aspersions and ad hominem attacks at us because we perceive this situation in a way you apparently cannot.

And we're the ones who are being "childish." =9[.]9=

Nah the game will just be as zoomy as POE1. That leap slam had no links and it wasnt much slower than Leap Slam in POE without much attack speed. Now imagine it with a 6 link, I bet it will be even faster.

The thing about POE is that it should be played the way you want to play it. IF you want an over powered build doing billions of damage, then play that build. IF you want a build that clears maps in less than a minute, play that build. If you want to play it with a challenging build that actually has to look at mechanics, play that build.

POE2 will be no different. An attendee moved the support skill gems to one skill and he was playing it just like POE 1.

"

Thesuffering wrote:

"

Raycheetah wrote:

Isn't it interesting that, where many of us criticize GGG for recent recent decisions, it is we who are criticized, even excoriated for not just sucking it up? PoE 1 is slammed because of the "zoom-zoom" playstyle which many (but not all) players have adopted, and PoE 2, as a separate game, is lauded as the solution. Who created the systems which made that possible, and encouraged them with timed-event mechanics?

If PoE 1 is broken beyond redemption, that's GGG's fault, not ours. All my anger and resentment is directed where I see the problems originating, not at my fellow exiles, even those who pour some truly vituperative attacks on those of us who speak out about our grievances as if they have no merit.

It's one thing if you don't agree, if you don't see things as some of us do; it's quite another to cast aspersions and ad hominem attacks at us because we perceive this situation in a way you apparently cannot.

And we're the ones who are being "childish." =9[.]9=

Nah the game will just be as zoomy as POE1. That leap slam had no links and it wasnt much slower than Leap Slam in POE without much attack speed. Now imagine it with a 6 link, I bet it will be even faster.

The thing about POE is that it should be played the way you want to play it. IF you want an over powered build doing billions of damage, then play that build. IF you want a build that clears maps in less than a minute, play that build. If you want to play it with a challenging build that actually has to look at mechanics, play that build.

POE2 will be no different. An attendee moved the support skill gems to one skill and he was playing it just like POE 1.

Oh, I know that. It's just that so many are hailing PoEablo as the solution to these non-problems, and sending stink-eye at those Exiles who don't play the game "correctly." ='[.]'=

#NotMyPoE

"

Foreverhappychan wrote:

Did you lot seriously think you were supporting what you are already playing? When you buy a movie ticket, you are not funding that movie. You are supplying the studio with a tiny contribution towards future projects.

This is only partially true. You're right in the sense that your money doesn't go back in time and literally fund the movie you're watching on the screen. But you absolutely are funding that movie by validating the director's vision and by signaling that you would like more films like it in the future. In PoE you can even wait till the end of the show (league) before buying your ticket. In that way more than any other comp you are actually funding what you're already playing.

Generally speaking, when you patronize the arts in this way, you get more of the same in the future - although artists are a volatile lot. For every Star Wars IP where funding the first gets you more of the same there is a Ridley Scott or a Stanley Kubrick where you get something new that is...surprising and in an entirely different genre. It's in the eye of the beholder which kind of game director's PoE has.

"

Raycheetah wrote:

Oh, I know that. It's just that so many are hailing PoEablo as the solution to these non-problems, and sending stink-eye at those Exiles who don't play the game "correctly." ='[.]'=

#NotMyPoE

My only problem is that you are punished in trade league for not doing zooom zoom or bossing builds. Perhaps the solution is to have a trade league that caps damage like the caps to poison damage? I'd be down for that.

"

Thesuffering wrote:

1. POE2 will be like POE1 with new mechanics that allows further builds. I made a post earlier about how they made the game artificially challenging and posting a video from an attendee even. But it seems to fall on deaf ears, almost as if people WANT to believe they have been betrayed.

they said the game would be one way, left it for 5 years then told us its not gonna be that way anymore. isnt that betrayal?

somewhere along the line they could have told us about it, but no they waited till exilecon 2023.

bear in mind wat was told in 2019 was poe2's existence would fix AND improve poe1. announcing it being separate means we dont get the fixes nor improvements.

for the ones who stuck around for the fixes, they get nothing. just take a look at poe2 melee. it has so much improvements. poe1? nah, we're just gonna move numbers around or maybe just not do anything.

"

Thesuffering wrote:

2. After the buyout, MTX is not about support, it is about looking good. 90% is owned by tencent right? Buying MTX to support the game is foolish at this point.

we dont know the data behind that. from my belief tencent gets 100% from poe china. ggg get their profit from international.

but even then we dont know for sure.

"

exsea wrote:

"

Thesuffering wrote:

1. POE2 will be like POE1 with new mechanics that allows further builds. I made a post earlier about how they made the game artificially challenging and posting a video from an attendee even. But it seems to fall on deaf ears, almost as if people WANT to believe they have been betrayed.

they said the game would be one way, left it for 5 years then told us its not gonna be that way anymore. isnt that betrayal?

somewhere along the line they could have told us about it, but no they waited till exilecon 2023.

bear in mind wat was told in 2019 was poe2's existence would fix AND improve poe1. announcing it being separate means we dont get the fixes nor improvements.

for the ones who stuck around for the fixes, they get nothing. just take a look at poe2 melee. it has so much improvements. poe1? nah, we're just gonna move numbers around or maybe just not do anything.

"

Thesuffering wrote:

2. After the buyout, MTX is not about support, it is about looking good. 90% is owned by tencent right? Buying MTX to support the game is foolish at this point.

we dont know the data behind that. from my belief tencent gets 100% from poe china. ggg get their profit from international.

but even then we dont know for sure.

I am not so sure we arent getting improvements in POE1. While they wont be like POE2 there will be improvements.

They are constantly improving the game, what improvements are you looking for?

Now they will have more resources once POE2 releases to make POE1 better. AFAIK they are doing POE1 with 8 people atm.

"

Thesuffering wrote:

"

exsea wrote:

bear in mind wat was told in 2019 was poe2's existence would fix AND improve poe1. announcing it being separate means we dont get the fixes nor improvements.

for the ones who stuck around for the fixes, they get nothing. just take a look at poe2 melee. it has so much improvements. poe1? nah, we're just gonna move numbers around or maybe just not do anything.

I am not so sure we arent getting improvements in POE1. While they wont be like POE2 there will be improvements.

They are constantly improving the game, what improvements are you looking for?

Now they will have more resources once POE2 releases to make POE1 better. AFAIK they are doing POE1 with 8 people atm.

sure we definitely would get improvements in poe 1.

but are you aware of the old exilecon 2019 announcements? poe2 and poe1 would be compatible. poe2's new gem system would replace poe1. any new mechanics and systems in poe2 would replace/improve poe1. poe1's gameplay would thus improved.

i gave a specific example, melee combat. poe2's melee combat is so freaking polished, i m amazed at how awesome it is.

ggg did mention it is very likely NOT going to port the animation/character rigging onto poe1, and by saying that, its likely we wont get those new melee animations and logically we will also not be getting the melee improvements.

all the time and effort on poe2 so far was supported by everyone who loved poe1. we were happy that ggg diverted resources away from poe1 to poe2 because whatever that was gonna be in poe2 would affect poe1 too.

the more obvious improvement is the new gem system. what does poe1 get?

zilch.

GGG's change of direction with poe 2 DIRECTLY meant that all the effort put into POE2 gave ZERO benefit to POE1.

"

exsea wrote:

sure we definitely would get improvements in poe 1.

but are you aware of the old exilecon 2019 announcements? poe2 and poe1 would be compatible. poe2's new gem system would replace poe1. any new mechanics and systems in poe2 would replace/improve poe1. poe1's gameplay would thus improved.

i gave a specific example, melee combat. poe2's melee combat is so freaking polished, i m amazed at how awesome it is.

ggg did mention it is very likely NOT going to port the animation/character rigging onto poe1, and by saying that, its likely we wont get those new melee animations and logically we will also not be getting the melee improvements.

all the time and effort on poe2 so far was supported by everyone who loved poe1. we were happy that ggg diverted resources away from poe1 to poe2 because whatever that was gonna be in poe2 would affect poe1 too.

the more obvious improvement is the new gem system. what does poe1 get?

zilch.

GGG's change of direction with poe 2 DIRECTLY meant that all the effort put into POE2 gave ZERO benefit to POE1.

That is because they couldnt change the engine in POE1 without significantly increasing the requirements for the game. That said they gave a new engine recently so maybe they are doing something about it, who knows.

As you can tell I am a glass half full kind of guy, so I always give the benefit of the doubt and the most charitable explanations.

But the lack of recent improvements could be because of a lack of resources, maybe POE1 will get improvements when they get 6x the size of thier current team. As POE2 starts nearing completion we will get better and better leagues like this upcoming one. I think gameplay improvements will be in the future, but they said animations couldnt be changed because of the tech in POE1 which is why they were making POE2. That is what they said AFAIK in Exilecon 1.

"

Thesuffering wrote:

"

exsea wrote:

sure we definitely would get improvements in poe 1.

but are you aware of the old exilecon 2019 announcements? poe2 and poe1 would be compatible. poe2's new gem system would replace poe1. any new mechanics and systems in poe2 would replace/improve poe1. poe1's gameplay would thus improved.

i gave a specific example, melee combat. poe2's melee combat is so freaking polished, i m amazed at how awesome it is.

ggg did mention it is very likely NOT going to port the animation/character rigging onto poe1, and by saying that, its likely we wont get those new melee animations and logically we will also not be getting the melee improvements.

all the time and effort on poe2 so far was supported by everyone who loved poe1. we were happy that ggg diverted resources away from poe1 to poe2 because whatever that was gonna be in poe2 would affect poe1 too.

the more obvious improvement is the new gem system. what does poe1 get?

zilch.

GGG's change of direction with poe 2 DIRECTLY meant that all the effort put into POE2 gave ZERO benefit to POE1.

That is because they couldnt change the engine in POE1 without significantly increasing the requirements for the game. That said they gave a new engine recently so maybe they are doing something about it, who knows.

At exilecon in 2019, GGG didn't give me the impression that the old engine was holding them back. As a matter of fact, it all doesn't matter, since the item system, the currency system, the skill tree system is all independent of the engine you use. From the first exilecon it was pretty obvious they were either going to improve the old engine or better could port the old game with updated item systems to the new engine. The engine is not the reason why Path of Exile 2 is a standalone game. And if GGG says so, it is an excuse.

The reasons are:

1) They want to go back to their "vision". They tested the waters with Ruthless by implementing it in POE 1. Most didn't like it, so they are keeping POE 1 alive for the moment and separate from POE 2.
2) They hit maximum revenue by drawing in the Diablo 3 zoom zoom crowd by killing off their original poe philosophy. You could actually say they sacrificed POE 1 for making POE 2.
3) They are now creating a game which is a mix of PoE, Diablo 4, Dark Souls & Hades. They expect they will be able to expand their current playerbase 10-fold by catering to these new type of gamers.