Pricefixing abuse on Playstaion

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Butch3r_kush wrote:

Why GGG will never do jack shit about the trade auction house on any consoles?

The truth is just that: it cost MONEY and time.

Doing nothing is by far the best way to save money. Even hiring a google programmer to simply provide us an efficient way to sort the auction house item is not worth their time and/or money, even if they make double the money that year, its just not worth it...

It's not about that.

They have specifically stated, repeatedly, that trade is supposed to be "hard".

On PC, trade is "hard" because you have visit people's hideouts and watch out for getting scammed and so on. Easy to find item, "hard" to actually get item.

On console, it is extremely easy to get the item, so it has to be "hard" to find the item.

That's GGG's stated position, including in the Baeclast interview with Chris, just a few weeks ago.

I honestly think GGG is completely out of touch on Trade difficulty.

I watch Twitch pretty often, and PC players do *not* have a hard time executing trades. It takes marginally longer than on console to "fetch" the item, but the total time for a PC player to find *exactly* the item they want, AND acquire it, is often less than 2 minutes. Sometimes less than 1.

Console players often require 30+ minutes just to find the item, and then still have to wait hours for the person to (hopefully) accept the trade, but likely not.

And, despite that PC players can offer to a dozen people simultaneously with committing any currency, we have to commit our currency to each trade, so we have to do them in series instead of parallel (unless rich and willing to overbuy if multiple accept in a short timeframe).

Honestly, I can live with the way the console trade market works, if they would just do something about the abusers. There are at least six different methods that have been suggested by the community, and GGG has not even answered most of them. They've basically said we won't be getting auto-accept. The rest of suggestions have just been ignored.

Well i saw this beaclast and i was fuming by this statement.

Chris Wilson is wrong about making trading difficult, its a really BAD game design and they know it! GGG see trading auction house as a QoL feature. So they 'had' to make it bad, be an eye sore, filled with scammer AND a waste of our 'precious' lifespan(we are not eternal, and so you too Chris)

Wich goes for the next question:

Is trade auction house a parasitic system in Path of Exile?

On paper: no. But in reality it is parasitic. By design, this economical system auction house trade system is a complete garbage, non-user friendly, poorly executed and grindy as fuck on EVERY levels.

Here is my 2 cents: If you are going to make a parasitic system; just abandon them on the drawing board; where it belong!

Is this why I see different prices on the trade market here, then on PS4. Because the difference seems great. Or is the trade on here meaningless?

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seth2474 wrote:

Is this why I see different prices on the trade market here, then on PS4. Because the difference seems great. Or is the trade on here meaningless?

Different from other prices on the same item on PS4, or different from PC?

Prices are different from PC *primarily* because of the much, much smaller playerbase, which has a big effect on the economy.

You see a wide variety of prices on identical items on PS4 for several reasons:

1) If it is a rare or valuable item, it may be pricefixed. This can be identified most of the time by trying to offer on a bunch of the items that are all listed at the lowest prices. If all the listings are from the same person, there's a 95% or higher chance that it is pricefixing.

2) Sometimes an item may have been listed much earlier in the league, when prices were different (higher or lower, depending on the item).

3) Some people just price things absurdly high for no reason I can discern.

4) Some items are priced very high as a sort of "not for sale" sign. Some players only have a very small number of tabs, and often only one of those is a premium tab. They feel forced to store things in that premium tab even when they don't want to sell them. If it is a popular item, they will be bombarded with offers if there's no price on it, so they price it very high, to discourage people from offering (some will still lowball anyway).

4b) There's a second set of "not for sale" type items... some players are just super lazy, and have literally ALL of their tabs marked public, and don't bother sorting for sale/not for sale items. Again, they may high-price some items to try and avoid getting offers on things they're not trying to sell.

5) There are often disputes or differences of opinion on the value of some items. If an item is both very rare and very low demand, then theoretically the seller could demand as much as they want (because there's no one else to buy from) or the buyer could demand the lowest feasible price (because there are no other buyers). In these situations, the sellers usually price very high, and no one buys (not worth it). But then, each time a new copy of the item turns up, that person will base their price on the existing price, but sometimes a little bit lower. A few of these sellers may lower their price every day or ever few days in an attempt to sell the item. This can lead to an item having 4 or 5 copies listed at *wildly* different prices, none of which are selling. An example of this from last league was Replica Farrul's Fur. A very rare and very powerful item, it should theoretically be very expensive. But none of the wealthy players wanted to buy one. So there were a few copies just sitting at very high prices (40+ exalts), while there were also a few copies whose price kept going down, because those sellers wanted to be the one to make a sale when someone finally did decide to buy one. At one point the prices ranged from 12ex for the cheapest to 58ex for the most expensive (admittedly comparing 4L to 6L, but the maximum possible value added by a non-corrupted 6L is about 8ex). This is a side effect of our super small economy.

There are probably additional reasons, but these are the main ones I have identified.

Well then the game will be unplayable. Even now I can't find or purchase or make what I need to survive. So we need to be cross platform for at least trade. Or something needs to be done.

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seth2474 wrote:

Well then the game will be unplayable. Even now I can't find or purchase or make what I need to survive. So we need to be cross platform for at least trade. Or something needs to be done.

While cross-platform would help, but still wouldn’t come close to PC numbers of players. Sinve Chris saiD for Hard mode they can play with drop rates, it means that they could do it for consoles (which has been said they couldn’t). Go figure.

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JoeUtopia wrote:

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seth2474 wrote:

Well then the game will be unplayable. Even now I can't find or purchase or make what I need to survive. So we need to be cross platform for at least trade. Or something needs to be done.

While cross-platform would help, but still wouldn’t come close to PC numbers of players. Sinve Chris saiD for Hard mode they can play with drop rates, it means that they could do it for consoles (which has been said they couldn’t). Go figure.

Please point out to where they said they *couldn't*?

There's no way GGG ever said that.

They may well have said they *wouldn't*, but that's not the same thing.

Also, it's not like PC SC Trade is the perfect play experience.

Do you really want 99.999% of everything you find to be literally worthless?

Sure, stuff is way cheaper on PC, but that also means you can't make any money by selling stuff.

And the wide availability of items means you finish a build much faster. The vast majority of players prefer to continuously get upgrades, rather than just reach the end state and then mindlessly farm for currency that you don't even need.

Actually, do you know what game works like that? D3. It's still around. It runs *great* on consoles. If this is the experience you want, go play D3.

If you hear that and think I should f right off, maybe think about *why* you prefer PoE to D3.

Think about which parts are the most enjoyable, when you have the most fun while playing.

Yes, Trade is broken, pretty badly.

But showering people in items or making everything nearly free is not the solution. It will *not* make the game more fun.

Problem with that is this is a game. If you are spending actual money on currency maybe I could see consern. I am not asking for flood loot. I am asking for fair price so I can play higher level. Because if you are not good at crafting, plus evey damn guide I read is to buy. If you are more casual or you know adult, getting currency to buy at the prices on console is next to impossible.

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seth2474 wrote:

Problem with that is this is a game. If you are spending actual money on currency maybe I could see consern. I am not asking for flood loot. I am asking for fair price so I can play higher level. Because if you are not good at crafting, plus evey damn guide I read is to buy. If you are more casual or you know adult, getting currency to buy at the prices on console is next to impossible.

I've explained this repeatedly...

Prices are high. Which means the way to deal with the market is to *sell things*, because you get more currency for the stuff you're selling.

Even if you can't craft (which is honestly not that hard to learn, if you want to), you can still sell good items you find on the ground, or uniques, or league currency, etc.

Since you get more currency for selling your stuff, you can afford to buy the "more expensive" stuff.

Or, you know, follow an SSF guide, like I also say a lot, because those guides will never tell you to buy anything.

95% of the issue which is causing players to complain about the console *pricing* is because they're looking at PC SC Trade guides. And those guides are often based on mid-league prices, when *everything* on PC that isn't mirror-worthy crafted item or the most uber-rare uniques are basically free.

If no one had ever told you that you "should" be able to buy a 6L Terminus Est for 7 Alterations (I exaggerate on purpose), then you wouldn't freak out when it costs 2ex.

The *actual* problem with console trade market is bad actors (price fixers, etc), but that doesn't affect the players who say they never make 2ex all league. At least, not much. Because the stuff being price-fixed is *mostly* 4ex+ div cards and the like.

Where it *does* affect you is things like Dense Fossils. Suppose you're following an SST guide, and it tells you just to spam dense fossils on your shield to get a good one.

But then you find out that 50% of the fossils are not actually for sale (because they're price fixed) and there's no way to tell which ones actually are for sale, and it takes 3 hours to buy 5 dense fossils at 4x the price they actually should be.

That's what needs attention.

Not the size of the economy or the drop rate of items.

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QQPQ wrote:

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seth2474 wrote:

Problem with that is this is a game. If you are spending actual money on currency maybe I could see consern. I am not asking for flood loot. I am asking for fair price so I can play higher level. Because if you are not good at crafting, plus evey damn guide I read is to buy. If you are more casual or you know adult, getting currency to buy at the prices on console is next to impossible.

I've explained this repeatedly...

Prices are high. Which means the way to deal with the market is to *sell things*, because you get more currency for the stuff you're selling.

Even if you can't craft (which is honestly not that hard to learn, if you want to), you can still sell good items you find on the ground, or uniques, or league currency, etc.

Since you get more currency for selling your stuff, you can afford to buy the "more expensive" stuff.

Or, you know, follow an SSF guide, like I also say a lot, because those guides will never tell you to buy anything.

95% of the issue which is causing players to complain about the console *pricing* is because they're looking at PC SC Trade guides. And those guides are often based on mid-league prices, when *everything* on PC that isn't mirror-worthy crafted item or the most uber-rare uniques are basically free.

If no one had ever told you that you "should" be able to buy a 6L Terminus Est for 7 Alterations (I exaggerate on purpose), then you wouldn't freak out when it costs 2ex.

The *actual* problem with console trade market is bad actors (price fixers, etc), but that doesn't affect the players who say they never make 2ex all league. At least, not much. Because the stuff being price-fixed is *mostly* 4ex+ div cards and the like.

Where it *does* affect you is things like Dense Fossils. Suppose you're following an SST guide, and it tells you just to spam dense fossils on your shield to get a good one.

But then you find out that 50% of the fossils are not actually for sale (because they're price fixed) and there's no way to tell which ones actually are for sale, and it takes 3 hours to buy 5 dense fossils at 4x the price they actually should be.

That's what needs attention.

Not the size of the economy or the drop rate of items.

And if you can't sell what you believe is fair quality stuff? I get that maybe we shouldn't look at PC pricing. But there is no Console pricing that I am aware of. I also agree very hard to find what you are looking for. Or able to do purchase offline. And no Crafting is not that difficult, just having the right stuff to do so is very hard to do. Getting orbs of fusing seems harder then Chaos orbs.