remove maven's memory game which is stupid and impossible to perform

+100!
this need delet memory game! +1

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Regikoko wrote:

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Pizzarugi wrote:

The problem here is not that the Maven is intrinsically difficult, it's that she uses a mechanic not seen anywhere else in the game and you're expected to not have ADHD or generally be slow at thinking and reacting in order to properly defeat the boss.

So, for first timers I agree that just throwing in a strange mechanic like this in a mostly just attack and dodge game is odd, But I think that is on purpose and there is logic behind as to why we never saw it before and have not seen it again. The Maven isn't there to destroy the atlas or kills us. We are her toy, and she wants to play with us. It's not until we defeat her that she realizes we are like her and not a toy at all. Every other battle in the game is a fight to the death with high stakes if we lose. The Maven just wants to play games. Also once you understand it's a memory game and not just another hit and dodge fight it becomes trivial for some and still standing by the argument that teaching people to remember a short list of commands and then execute them in a high stress environment is a useful skill for anyone to learn from someone working for min wage taking orders at McDonalds to the surgeon who has to make decisions on the fly that could be life or death.

(Also, people with ADHD can pay attention for short periods of time and as they grow into adults learn to control themselves to an extent or else none of them would ever get outta school or be able to do any job. Those slow at thinking can improve with practice. No one is a lost cause unless they give up on themselves)

The bit about Maven isn't accurate, though. She is intent on killing you. By using her Decree to enter her arena, you're accepting her invitation to join her macabre collection of souls you helped her acquire. When she witnesses boss fights, she gathers them for her collection and says as much when her speeches become more advanced. When you fight her, she calls you the prize piece that has come to join her collection. When she kills you, she says the prettiest piece makes the set complete.

This is enforced further when you speak to the Envoy about the Elderslayers. He explains that he's aware of the power of the six working together to defeat the Elder, but each one individually was vulnerable. She now owns four of them and is very upset that the remaining two (Sirus and Zana) still elude her. This is because she singled out and killed Baran, Drox, Al-Hezmin, and Veritania, collecting their souls to be her toys for all eternity.

When you defeat her in combat, you're outright defying her demand to collect you, that you are a living being with a will of your own. The reason she still tries to kill you in future battles is explained by the Envoy, that she's a child with an extremely short memory span. She'll remember the pain of defeat, but only for a moment.

She is an eldritch horror whose focus is around conflict. Her visit to the atlas is because she is drawn to the violence happening there, the same violence you are constantly perpetuating. She may not be the most malicious compared to the Cleansing Fire and the Tangle, but that doesn't make her good or even neutral. No doubt the conflict for dominion over the atlas between Eater and Exarch is something she enjoys as much as you championing her own control. She's merely the lesser evil, and to her, you are still a toy to be collected.

Making the Maven kill a requirement for the atlas unlock this league is a game killer for me. I have ms with memory issues so the Maven memory game is impossible. In prior leagues it was OK since Maven was optional but now Maven is required for the atlas.

I really think GGG should be focused on making their game more accessible instead of less, but I'm not a designer. Their new bosses this league are great. Maven just makes me uninstall. I'd prefer it if they left Maven optional and not tied to an atlas unlock.

shes not rly required tho.


we never had all our maps being t16 before, and actually having all ur maps being t16 is really bad. i have 4 voidstones and i would never socket more than 3, you lose all map drops below t16 essentially and sustaining maps will become a lot harder. the value of the maps you drop in terms of what u can get out of them if played and in terms of market value is far lower with 4 voidstones socketed than 3.



honestly ur fine with 2, having 2 voidstones gets ur atlas to roughly where it was with all 32 watchstones socketed previously. if u can beat uber elder u get the 3rd which is take it or leave it tbh, if you really want a map in ur t16 pool that is in the bracket that get upgraded with the 3rd stone then sure use it. if not its not doing much for you.

i would advise never using 4 even if u have them unless ur a millionaire megajuicer in which case u can just 1 shot maven phases and get ur stone easy anyway.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

shes not rly required tho.


we never had all our maps being t16 before, and actually having all ur maps being t16 is really bad. i have 4 voidstones and i would never socket more than 3, you lose all map drops below t16 essentially and sustaining maps will become a lot harder. the value of the maps you drop in terms of what u can get out of them if played and in terms of market value is far lower with 4 voidstones socketed than 3.



honestly ur fine with 2, having 2 voidstones gets ur atlas to roughly where it was with all 32 watchstones socketed previously. if u can beat uber elder u get the 3rd which is take it or leave it tbh, if you really want a map in ur t16 pool that is in the bracket that get upgraded with the 3rd stone then sure use it. if not its not doing much for you.

i would advise never using 4 even if u have them unless ur a millionaire megajuicer in which case u can just 1 shot maven phases and get ur stone easy anyway.

Correct, we never had all of our maps be T16. The bare minimum in the previous atlas was T14 which I thought was acceptable. There's quite a noticeable difference between two tiers in regards to enemy difficulty.

However, you can't even achieve this by killing the two quest eldritch bosses. Only half of all of your maps are T14+ while the other half is split between lesser red tiers and yellows. In order to get any higher, you'll have to beat Maven or Uber Elder, the former being the easier. It was much better when she and Uber Elder were optional bosses you'd farm for currency, not a requirement to get more maps to T14+.

Remember that in the previous atlas, we only needed to fight the Elderslayers which were a lot easier by comparison. This is unquestionably a big nerf for atlas progression.

well you get 43x t16 maps with 2 voidstones socketed, im fairly sure thats about the same if not more than having 32 watchstones socketed.


do you really need more than that? what do you really benefit beyond that? youre not getting any more t14-16 maps to run. you get less variety of t14 maps, but if youre only dipping down to t14 to buff up ur t16 now and then does that even matter? if you are at that late game stage where you are basically trying to stay at t16 as much as possible its the same variety as before, maybe more so, with 2 voidstones. presuming they fix the bugs it will be more controllable too with the favourite system.

every time u get a harvest where u need to sacrifice a map to get a mission etc if you only have t14 maps ur sacrificing t14s, rather than white or yellow maps. its handy to have some yellows.


i honestly dont think fighting 32 elderslayers was easier than fighting these 4 once each on the green versions. i think its a lot faster to get 2 voidstones certainly.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

well you get 43x t16 maps with 2 voidstones socketed, im fairly sure thats about the same if not more than having 32 watchstones socketed.


do you really need more than that? what do you really benefit beyond that? youre not getting any more t14-16 maps to run. you get less variety of t14 maps, but if youre only dipping down to t14 to buff up ur t16 now and then does that even matter? if you are at that late game stage where you are basically trying to stay at t16 as much as possible its the same variety as before, maybe more so, with 2 voidstones. presuming they fix the bugs it will be more controllable too with the favourite system.

every time u get a harvest where u need to sacrifice a map to get a mission etc if you only have t14 maps ur sacrificing t14s, rather than white or yellow maps. its handy to have some yellows.


i honestly dont think fighting 32 elderslayers was easier than fighting these 4 once each on the green versions. i think its a lot faster to get 2 voidstones certainly.

It isn't about the maps being T16. We used to have all maps be T14-T16 with the old atlas, but since we don't have that anymore, it's T16 or nothing.

What if I want T14 or T16 Cemetary maps, because I enjoy the layout? What if I really like the monster density in Underground Sea? They're T11 and T8 respectively with 2 voidstones fitted in. I can't run those, not without severely losing profit for the sake of enjoyment.

Just because we have several T14+s doesn't mean we have each map we personally enjoy of that tier.

And, again, the expectation to kill these super pinnacle bosses is a lot worse than fighting the Elderslayers.

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Pizzarugi wrote:

What if I want T14 or T16 Cemetary maps, because I enjoy the layout? What if I really like the monster density in Underground Sea? They're T11 and T8 respectively with 2 voidstones fitted in. I can't run those, not without severely losing profit...

Buy a carry and recoup your investment over time.

Its not the end of the world, just a speedbump.

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Orbaal wrote:

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Pizzarugi wrote:

What if I want T14 or T16 Cemetary maps, because I enjoy the layout? What if I really like the monster density in Underground Sea? They're T11 and T8 respectively with 2 voidstones fitted in. I can't run those, not without severely losing profit...

Buy a carry and recoup your investment over time.

Its not the end of the world, just a speedbump.

You never had to do this at any point in the past, this shouldn't change now.

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Pizzarugi wrote:

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Orbaal wrote:

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Pizzarugi wrote:

What if I want T14 or T16 Cemetary maps, because I enjoy the layout? What if I really like the monster density in Underground Sea? They're T11 and T8 respectively with 2 voidstones fitted in. I can't run those, not without severely losing profit...

Buy a carry and recoup your investment over time.

Its not the end of the world, just a speedbump.

You never had to do this at any point in the past, this shouldn't change now.

You never had a full T16 atlas before either.
To get what you previously you just need 3 voidstones, which you already dismissed and pointed towards its "all or nothing" - as if that was a valid point.
Thats a you issue and not an inherent problem with the atlas system.

Besides, with all the map shuffles going on each league you were never in a position to guarantee your favourite maps would be t16s anyways or even available in the first place.

You do what you always have to do: You adapt and act accordingly.
Nothing has changed in that regard.

Also, if profit is your main issue: I highly doubt you could make more profit this easily with the old atlas. Its overall a massive buff across the board with a minor speedbump in case you want all the juice you could possibly get.
How is that all the sudden an issue?