[3.20] Ice Dancing Queen - Icestorm/Cyclone/CI - Viable For Everything

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Kelvynn wrote:

3. What's the thought process behind using Arcane Surge not in the staff, like before 3.15?

Oh, nm, I see! I forgot that it got double-buffed in 3.15. Even at a low level, combined with a weaker damage support in the staff, it will give more damage than its high level version alone. Good catch!

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archwerewolf wrote:

well in theory i can get discipline+hatred+blasphemy+f&s hm... or instead of f&s skitterbots for more dmg xD

You really should dump Skitterbots. The sources of 'inc damage taken' are additive, not multiplicative. The enemy is already taking inc dmg from Inquisitor, Unnerve and Aspect of the Spider. Adding a 4th source of about the same effect for 35% mana reservation just isn't worth it.

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Kelvynn wrote:

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archwerewolf wrote:

well in theory i can get discipline+hatred+blasphemy+f&s hm... or instead of f&s skitterbots for more dmg xD

You really should dump Skitterbots. The sources of 'inc damage taken' are additive, not multiplicative. The enemy is already taking inc dmg from Inquisitor, Unnerve and Aspect of the Spider. Adding a 4th source of about the same effect for 35% mana reservation just isn't worth it.

nah me witch :D me here cause forum witch theme dead.
it's pity that for fun profane bloom you must take 1 slot of aura to blasphemy :/
well even without f&s it's ok in terms of survability

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Kelvynn wrote:

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Kelvynn wrote:

3. What's the thought process behind using Arcane Surge not in the staff, like before 3.15?

Oh, nm, I see! I forgot that it got double-buffed in 3.15. Even at a low level, combined with a weaker damage support in the staff, it will give more damage than its high level version alone. Good catch!

Nevermind x2! The 2nd 20% MORE buff on Arcane Surge works only with Supported Skills. If it's not in the staff then Icestorm is not Supported by it. PoB shows that you actually lose damage by moving it out of the staff and using a weaker damage support instead. And you also lose 1 gem socket by doing that.

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Kelvynn wrote:

Grats!

A couple of questions since your characters are not public:

1. 200k avg hit vs what: Trash mobs or Sirus?

2. Where did you put the 3rd Large cluster?

3. What's the thought process behind using Arcane Surge not in the staff, like before 3.15?

Should be public now.
200k against Sirus.

3rd cluster is in the far left position, could be far right as well, doesn't really matter. First reason is that I needed slots for Pure talent, Watchers eye, Emperor's Talent and Emperor's Wit somewhere. I figured that having another cluster there would give me another CttC to give back damage I loose from not converting all the str/dex to int as well as another Prismatic Hearth. Also not using Astramentis/Three Rat Talisman I need to get some extra str/dex from somewhere anyway. With this setup (and dex/int implict amulet) I have 141str 126dex. Awakened Cold Penetration requires 126dex and with reduced attribute requirements in amulet I can even use lvl20 Immortal Call.

For Arcane Surge, you get half of the buff to all damage regardless what procs it. Also when I first tried it (lvl40 or so) I was not happy with it needing some time to activate, especially with not having enough mana regen to channel all the time. I felt by the time surge activates, mobs are dead and I had ran out of mana, it felt its just better to have another support that is active 100% of the time.

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archwerewolf wrote:

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Kelvynn wrote:

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archwerewolf wrote:

well in theory i can get discipline+hatred+blasphemy+f&s hm... or instead of f&s skitterbots for more dmg xD

You really should dump Skitterbots. The sources of 'inc damage taken' are additive, not multiplicative. The enemy is already taking inc dmg from Inquisitor, Unnerve and Aspect of the Spider. Adding a 4th source of about the same effect for 35% mana reservation just isn't worth it.

nah me witch :D me here cause forum witch theme dead.
it's pity that for fun profane bloom you must take 1 slot of aura to blasphemy :/
well even without f&s it's ok in terms of survability

Even for the Occultist, you still have Unnerve (10%) and Aspect (15%) already.

I don't get some other things in your setup either:

1. Where do you get the 3rd curse? You don't have Whispers of Doom.

2. Why Frost Bomb AND PWoC? They apply the same exact debuff.

PoB extravaganza!

So for Arcane Surge PoB shows me this is (little) better for damage.

ACP(lvl5,20q) is +36.8% average hit, AS(lvl20,20q) is +45.0% average hit, so it looks like AS is better? But the +45.0% damage is what it gives compared to not having AS at all.

lvl4 AS gives 12% more damage buff, so is it better to have 12% more and ACP or 20%+19% more from lvl20 AS. If you look numbers that way ACP is now still the same +36.8% but AS is only +29.3%. So this is actually little better for damage.

hm failed quotes...

1) why GGG whyyy you removed +1 curse from aw hex....
so no 3rd, -enfeeble )
2)forgot to remove after testing, wave better for debuffing ton's of mobs in simulacrum for example

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Cjin wrote:

For Arcane Surge, you get half of the buff to all damage regardless what procs it. Also when I first tried it (lvl40 or so) I was not happy with it needing some time to activate, especially with not having enough mana regen to channel all the time. I felt by the time surge activates, mobs are dead and I had ran out of mana, it felt its just better to have another support that is active 100% of the time.

-mana cost craft is not really necessary after they un-nerfed some of the mana nerfs. A more useful craft now is recovering mana when you take damage. Let's you do No Regen maps too.

AS takes 2-3 sec to proc, and then it stays on for 8 sec. Since you constantly cast while moving and barely ever stop to pick up loot, that's not a problem at all. For the bosses you can always pre-cast.

You are doing slightly less damage, but more importantly, you have 1 less socket. I like Frost Shield.

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archwerewolf wrote:

hm failed quotes...

1) why GGG whyyy you removed +1 curse from aw hex....
so no 3rd, -enfeeble )
2)forgot to remove after testing, wave better for debuffing ton's of mobs in simulacrum for example

PWoC is better for everything. It's a direct upgrade over Frost Bomb.

No Enfeeble? On top of already dropping shock and ignite immunity? I guess you are just not feeling it because your gear is so OP that you can facetank anything. If your budget had any limits, this would be very much unplayable. I suspect you still die once in a while in hard maps because of it.