[3.9] Cyclone Summoner - Heralds of Agony and Purity, Summon Holy Relic - League starter

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Microdia wrote:

After a few days playing this build, and gearing it. I can honestly say I can't find anything that can outright kill me. I can facetank all guardians regardless of mods, uber izaro, anything really. The damage is bonkers, things die in like seconds. I changed my second ring to an unset and I am running blood rage, and I'm going to use the rest of my points 92+ for endurance charges. I changed to haste over hatred as well because it speeds up clear and honestly, we just dont need the extra damage, not to mention vaal haste is amazing. If anyone is interested in seeing what I've done here is my pob.

https://pastebin.com/KtbMhseY

Hey, thanks for providing your notes! I'll take a detailed look today. Blood Rage is something I was considering, but didn't find a slot for. Haste and Vaal Haste are certainly good additions. I totally agree the points after 90 should be put into life and endurance charges.

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tainium wrote:

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jubsey wrote:

...Where do we go in tree after level 90...

Life.

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Build is crazy. Currently at lvl 89 with 7k hp. Just facetanked mino and hydra no problem. I'm not great at game mechanics so this build is a godsend to me :D
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Agree. I'm in SSF without most of the 'required' gear and am having no problems in T11-T14 maps.

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Mooginator wrote:

What's the 6th link we put for Herald of Agony?

He lists it on the OP :)

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Toverkol wrote:

...Regarding charges, yeah you lose those. ...

We do get 12% IAS from Frenzy and res+phys from Endurance so just having the charges is good enough. I was just toying with ideas to abuse them more. I think the only thing really viable for us is Snakebite which looks like a decent starter item until you can get good gloves.

After 90 grab life as suggested and some extra endurance charges. 6th link is Damage on Full Life or Vile Toxins depending on which 4th off-colour socket you get (I think DoFL is ideal). Fenzy and Endurance charges are actually really nice for us - Frenzy for the attack speed and Endurance for the tankiness. We don't need anything more from them than that.

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tainium wrote:

I'm considering a downgrade on Herald of Purity to 3L or removing it altogether. The skill has several effects but the only one that we actually use is "20% chance to Summon a Sentinel of Purity when you Hit a Unique Enemy". Is that worth half our mana pool? If it were an Aura that added damage to our Minions then I'd say to keep it. Alternatively, we could try something to earn more of credit for kills while clearing so that they are at least active more often.

Effects we use
Maximum 4 Summoned Sentinels of Purity
20% chance to Summon a Sentinel of Purity when you Hit a Unique Enemy

Effects we waste
Adds (3-25) to (5-37) Physical Damage to Spells
Adds (3-25) to (5-37) Physical Damage to Attacks
Summon a Sentinel of Purity when you Kill an Enemy



Holy Relics, OTOH, feel like the real heavy-lifters to me. If they die while you're Cycloning then you can actually detect a distinct drop in DPS. The Crawler is also great but a bit slow and I think it might be better to link it specifically for large AOE clearing (more projectiles? Chain?) or to increase its attack speed.

So I think absolutely "20% chance to Summon a Sentinel of Purity when you Hit a Unique Enemy" is worth it here. Although they don't change our clear speed much, Sentinels of Purity really contribute to our single target. viperesque said to me the other day that we really should be using Maim support in the HoP setup and I already thought I was! If you add in Maim (I'll be making a large update to the guide this weekend which will include Maim) they'll deal slightly more damage as well as enabling your other minions to deal more damage.

Let's suppose we didn't want to use Herald of Purity... what's the alternative here? None of the other heralds benefit us, so are we removing Coming Calamity? Then we would have 80% (rough guess) reservation, and wouldn't be able to do anything with the mana anyway. If we keep Coming Calamiy, we have 55% unreserved, we could run Arctic Armour (not bad, but we're moving all the time so we waste the fire damage reduction) or add Mind Over Matter. Mind Over Matter might be interesting as we've got a tonne of mana gain, but I don't think we can reasonably pick up enough mana nodes to get our pool large enough to make this a big effect. Considering we're already facetanking Guardians and some of Shaper, I don't think we need more tankiness from this mana. If you'd like to investigate these or other options and keep me updated, I'm keen to engage in further discussion.

Regarding Summon Holy Relics as the heavy hitters - they are, but for clear only in my experience. Both of our herald minions help out so much in single target fights I'd would estimate Holy Relics to be only about 20 damage against bosses if that. Perhaps you need to grab some Fear (minion movement speed) jewelry if you find the crawler to be slow? I don't find that at all.

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systemplayerlost wrote:

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Microdia wrote:

After a few days playing this build, and gearing it. I can honestly say I can't find anything that can outright kill me. I can facetank all guardians regardless of mods, uber izaro, anything really. The damage is bonkers, things die in like seconds. I changed my second ring to an unset and I am running blood rage, and I'm going to use the rest of my points 92+ for endurance charges. I changed to haste over hatred as well because it speeds up clear and honestly, we just dont need the extra damage, not to mention vaal haste is amazing. If anyone is interested in seeing what I've done here is my pob.

https://pastebin.com/KtbMhseY

Hey, thanks for providing your notes! I'll take a detailed look today. Blood Rage is something I was considering, but didn't find a slot for. Haste and Vaal Haste are certainly good additions. I totally agree the points after 90 should be put into life and endurance charges.

Sorry, I should clarify, Haste is good, but I'm unsure if it's worth sacrificing Hatred for.

I was thinking the same thing, but then I realized I dont need the damage, things dies in seconds, and will probably add a temp chains/phasing while affected by haste watcher's eye. If later on damage feels low I may change back, but right now it seems to me that the movement speed, clear speed, and attack speed seems to trump the damage gain from hatred.

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Microdia wrote:

I was thinking the same thing, but then I realized I dont need the damage, things dies in seconds, and will probably add a temp chains/phasing while affected by haste watcher's eye. If later on damage feels low I may change back, but right now it seems to me that the movement speed, clear speed, and attack speed seems to trump the damage gain from hatred.

Yeah interesting! I'll definitely have to give it a go sometime soon.

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systemplayerlost wrote:

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Microdia wrote:

I was thinking the same thing, but then I realized I dont need the damage, things dies in seconds, and will probably add a temp chains/phasing while affected by haste watcher's eye. If later on damage feels low I may change back, but right now it seems to me that the movement speed, clear speed, and attack speed seems to trump the damage gain from hatred.

Yeah interesting! I'll definitely have to give it a go sometime soon.

look at my post on page 4 ;-)

For Ghastly jewels, I assume that "Minions deal X to X additional X damage" applies to spells as well as attacks despite it being unclear.

I'd just want to know how much damage really is tied to herald of agony. Dropping that as well as all poison related stuff would open up a lot of opportunities.
Just brainstorming:
Link HOP and relics with physical to lightning support, reserve some more mana with a generosity-supported hatred AND go for elemental equilibrium?
+ you'd get another ring slot.

Or just go full physical with maim support increased attack speed and brutality support for HOP, drop hatred for haste (keep in essence worm) and run purity of elements as well to cap relic resistances and get more room on gear/juwel affixes.
And with increased relic resistances and maybe a few extra minion life nodes it may even be possible to go for minion damage/controlled destruction/brutality on them as well.

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tainium wrote:

For Ghastly jewels, I assume that "Minions deal X to X additional X damage" applies to spells as well as attacks despite it being unclear.

Yup :)