[3.1] The Blinding Blizzard - Whispering Ice Berserker - Viable for Most Everything

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Kelvynn wrote:

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Keyen wrote:

Berserker WI is dead, fyi. Leech doesn't work, and everything else is attack only

Berserker was pronounced dead 5 pages ago, when the word 'Attack' was added to Pain Reaver. That's why we are looking for a new class in the first place :)

Wups, sorry then^^

I really believe the Trickster is a serious contender for the berserker in terms of damage, while being much more tanky due to the evasion cap, the dodge and the reduced damage (instead of increased damage taken).

It's not perfect, but it's clearly head and shoulders above the elementalist in terms of dps and the 0,5% leech doesn't compare it in terms of tankyness.

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Keyen wrote:

Also, 100% cold damage -> 45% chaos damage
90% fire damage -> 40,5% chaos damage.

You are doing 10% cold damage, 90% fire damage and 85,5% chaos damage (so it's 85,5% more damage compared to the 100% base damage).

And you are not losing the 10% cold damage, so there is no 10% less damage from the incomplete conversion.

Right, not losing 10%, my bad.

But where is 85.5% coming from? It doesn't matter what portion is cold or fire, we do 100% initial damage.

You think Harness the Void applies 3 independent rolls, and you can actually get all 3 gains?? That would be just insane. No way GGG is going to release something so broken.

My theory is that the description means that you have 10% chance to gain 200%, and if you don't win that roll then you have 15% chance to gain 100%, etc. Even that way you still gain 60% on average which is crazy and broken for a lot of builds.

So that 60% gain would work similarly to Berserker's 40% MORE damage, except that you can't apply any penetration to that and you have to sacrifice 1 gem for it.

The 3 are independant, but it means you get 45% chaos per hit on average (0,2*50% + 0,15*100% + 0,1*200% = 45%). It means you get 45% from the 100% cold, then 40,5% from the 90% fire.

So +85,5% from a 100% base.

And you don't lose a gem, you lose a ring, which is different.


Also, you have to remember the +85,5% more dps is clearly oversimplified. In practice, you also have wither 15 stacks, which is a +90% more damage chaos, not reduced by the shaper curse effectiveness. It's MUCH MUCH more than 85,5% more damage.

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Keyen wrote:

The 3 are independant, but it means you get 45% chaos per hit on average. It means you get 45% from the 100% cold, then 40,5% from the 90% fire.

So +85,5% from a 100% base.

And you don't lose a gem, you lose a ring, which is different.

That's crazy. If they let this go live it will need to be nerfed right away.

And yes, you lose a gem, for Life Leech. Or am I missing some other way Trickster can leech?

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Kelvynn wrote:

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Keyen wrote:

The 3 are independant, but it means you get 45% chaos per hit on average. It means you get 45% from the 100% cold, then 40,5% from the 90% fire.

So +85,5% from a 100% base.

And you don't lose a gem, you lose a ring, which is different.

That's crazy. If they let this go live it will need to be nerfed right away.

And yes, you lose a gem, for Life Leech. Or am I missing some other way Trickster can leech?

Atziri promise. Get two for guardians/shaper. It also synergize perfectly with the multiple conversion as well.

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Keyen wrote:

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Kelvynn wrote:

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Keyen wrote:

The 3 are independant, but it means you get 45% chaos per hit on average. It means you get 45% from the 100% cold, then 40,5% from the 90% fire.

So +85,5% from a 100% base.

And you don't lose a gem, you lose a ring, which is different.

That's crazy. If they let this go live it will need to be nerfed right away.

And yes, you lose a gem, for Life Leech. Or am I missing some other way Trickster can leech?

Atziri promise. Get two for guardians/shaper.

That's unreliable. When your whole ability to leech depends on flasks - that's not going to cut it for a tank build. Maps with reduced flask charges will become a problem. And you won't become powerful enough overnight to delete T16 bosses in less than 20 sec (4 flask uses). I don't want the build to require godly gear right from the start. There has to be real leech.

BTW, how do you get 15 Wither stacks here? You can't use any supports.

You have 90% duration from the node in the tree (because it's OP on icestorm anyway).

So your wither has a 3,8s duration. You need 11% cast speed to stack it at 15.

If you don't like Atziri promise, you can still use warlord mark. But there is the problem of hexproof maps. And if you have both, you can switch a lifeleech gem, but it shouldn't be the norm.

what do u think about going tri curse occu?
- curse on hexproof
- increased curse effect
- malediction
- some nice es
- stun immun
i like the idea about trying some fancy curse wi occu ^.^

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Keyen wrote:

If you don't like Atziri promise, you can still use warlord mark. But there is the problem of hexproof maps. And if you have both, you can switch a lifeleech gem, but it shouldn't be the norm.

WM leech is almost useless against big bosses (-80% curse efficiency hurts). Trickster will have to use Life Leech.

I just don't believe that something so broken can actually be released. Gonna work on the Elementalist for now until I see the final patch notes. And a confirmation that Harness the Void will indeed work that way. If Trickster really gets all this extra damage then yeah, an idea worth trying.

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Yuzlol wrote:

what do u think about going tri curse occu?
- curse on hexproof
- increased curse effect
- malediction
- some nice es
- stun immun
i like the idea about trying some fancy curse wi occu ^.^

Occultist doesn't have anything for elemental damage. 10% MORE damage from Malediction and 24% gained Chaos but only while killing, so not for the bosses. There used to be an Occ WI build that could outrecharge T16 bosses with some uber godly gear before the ES nerf. But he took forever to kill them, and I don't think he even killed the Shaper. It's more of a HC option - you'll never die if you don't go for anything hard. The same goes for the Guardian too. But this build is designed for facerolling the hard stuff.

Elementalist will have a lot more DPS than Occultist, and decent survivability. And if Trickster gets released the way it looks right now, he'll definitely have a whole lot more DPS than Occultist.