Balance Changes to Chill, Shock, and Charges

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xMustard wrote:
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Nephalim wrote:
Considering most builds use insane cast(spell echo) or attack speed(multistrike), it is extremely unlikely you will do that much on hit damage especially after bosses get their health doubled.

Mechanically it's just bad from the ground up even at 10%.

Just as an example, phoenix has 12 million health. In order to do 10% damage you need a single hit to do 1.2 million damage or 2.4 million damage post 3.0. This is literally impossible. Most builds struggle to do even 1.2 million damage with attack/cast speed factored in.


ya but that is for max effect. at least there is no minimum threshold so you can still get a chill/shock even if its low in power. that at least allows you to benefit from mechanics vs chilled/shocked bosses, like hypothermia
You get max 4% increase damage from shock on bosses of course if you lucky to even shock. It's not worth it at all.
Still dislike grand spectrum changes
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Still dislike grand spectrum changes


When you can't figure out to balance a certain item well then remove it's identity.

Grand Garbage.
Dys an sohm
Rohs an kyn
Sahl djahs afah
Mah morn narr
Last edited by Coconutdoggy on Aug 1, 2017, 6:30:53 PM
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H3rmanos wrote:
I was hoping that split arrow jewel would make it into the game since it would make split arrow viable again after the poison nerfs. Kinda disappointed :(


It was a little cheeky of them to put all the Split Arrow MTX on sale, then remove the jewel the following day.
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imLuCaSsS wrote:
Power/Frenzy charges work with too many different items/classes/builds on this game


Why is it bad that everyone can benefit a bit from all charges? And what's the point of Conduit, if you have no advantage from at least 2 charge types?

If the bonuses are too strong, why not decrease all of them instead of cutting e.g. spellcaster benefit out of frenzy charges?

How about some kind of quest at whose end you can chose from some options of what bonus a charge will give to you?
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imLuCaSsS wrote:
Power/Frenzy charges work with too many different items/classes/builds on this game


Why is it bad that everyone can benefit a bit from all charges? And what's the point of Conduit, if you have no advantage from at least 2 charge types?

If the bonuses are too strong, why not decrease all of them instead of cutting e.g. spellcaster benefit out of frenzy charges?

How about some kind of quest at whose end you can chose from some options of what bonus a charge will give to you?

decrease the bonuses charges status is a very bad idea. Decreasing it would means any build that use charges would be forced to take it all and it costs at least 6 skill points, its mostly allocated after end-game and sometimes isn't that easy to take it all, specially if u needing life/ES and specially if u play HC ( like me ).

endurance/frenzy/power charges are just one thing so it should be exactly the same thing to everybody, I don't think "choose" what status you want for each charge is a viable option as well. It would be a real mess xD



My end, it justifies my means,
All I ever do is delay,
My every attempt to evade,
The end of the road
And my end....
Last edited by imLuCaSsS on Aug 1, 2017, 7:08:17 PM
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Kastmar wrote:
You get max 4% increase damage from shock on bosses of course if you lucky to even shock. It's not worth it at all.


You're forgetting another reason they have for making this change - imo, the chief one: conditionals.

There's already a fair number of things in the game that do something when you do something to a chilled / frozen / shocked enemy. But with bosses those things basically never apply - now they will. And it's likely there's more of those things to come. So it's not just about the amount of damage / slow we get, but rather about builds that build off of chilling, freezing or shocking enemies for benefits other than the default use of those ailments.
#keepchargesneutral

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imLuCaSsS wrote:


(about charges) Decreasing it would means any build that use charges would be forced to take it all and it costs at least 6 skill points, its mostly allocated after end-game and sometimes isn't that easy to take it all, specially if u needing life/ES and specially if u play HC ( like me ).

endurance/frenzy/power charges are just one thing so it should be exactly the same thing to everybody, I don't think "choose" what status you want for each charge is a viable option as well. It would be a real mess xD





Yeah, what about the classes that ride the lines between the charge centers? (scion, shadow, duelist, and templar)? You want to cut them out of half of their accessible piece of the pie, simply depending on whether they go with a spell or an attack? (power charges should offer a smaller "more" bonus, but on all damage rather than just spells, imo. Felt this way since forever)
Quoting Saltychipmunk:
...I look at the new act 5 boss where you have to hide behind the statues to survive the bullet hell and all I can think is... how the fuck are zombies going to survive that?

They don't know what hiding is... they don't know what dodging is... they are morons.
Last edited by joachimbond on Aug 1, 2017, 7:15:01 PM
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NessOnett8 wrote:
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bogzy wrote:
So back to using frenzy charges in every single build. So much diversity! I hate having to use blood rage in most builds.


Why do you people just lie? Like, if you have an actual argument to what you're saying, make it.

According to the statistics, less than 12% of players level 90+ in legacy league used blood rage.

You, yourself, have used Blood Rage on only one of your last 5 characters.


This universe you've concocted in your head where "Everyone uses frenzy charges" is a delusional fantasy. Yes, a lot more people used frenzy charges this league because RAIDER WAS THE MOST USED CLASS. And Raider is built around frenzy charges. And they designed from the get go around them, it wasn't just 'tacked on' as you people imply. But even then it's far from the norm overall, and even in the most favorable non-ranger classes for frenzy charges(berserkers and assassins), they barely broke 20% blood rage use.

This thing you keep citing is not a thing that exists. It's like anti-vaxxers. You can say it over and over and over, but it won't suddenly make it true. But maybe you're just trying to convince yourself...




But even if what you were saying WERE true. That's no reason to change frenzy charges. That would be an indictment of blood rage in how easy it is to work in to generate frenzy charges. If people can get something for 'free' it doesn't matter how much or how little power it gives, they will take it. And if blood rage is too free thats a problem with it, not with frenzy.


this whole thing made me laugh, i very much enjoy your style!
I'm fairly satisfied with the changes to shock/chill. You'll benefit from a chilled/shocked enemy for things like Hypothermia etc.
Spoiler
Correct me if I'm wrong but if there's no minimum threshold to apply shock then every hit is going to deal more damage than the last. So, assuming you have a high enough chance to shock and/or increased shock duration you're just going to keep dealing more and more damage as the hits (and therefore the shock effect) keep getting bigger.

You don't need to outright deal 10% of a monster's health to apply a max effect shock (which you wouldn't need if you could deal such damage) but instead you slowly increase your damage.

I did some maths and found that if your first hit deals 0.2% of a monster's health you'd need about 100 hits to kill it as opposed to 500 without shocking it. Pretty effective!

Same rule applies to chill although it doesn't increase your damage obviously.

EDIT: I was wrong :)



As regards frenzy/power charges, I read posts here and there and I think that 2% more damage on power and frenzy charges should do the trick.

It should provide enough incentive to use these charges for their specific bonuses (crit and attack/cast speed) as well as the more damage multiplier, without making them too powerful or "reducing build diversity"

By the way, I haven't been playing the game for very long so I might not understand the game as well as I think I do.

Keep up the good work GGG!

Peace,
Last edited by szadikk on Aug 1, 2017, 9:31:24 PM

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