[2.6] CRIT HoWA BF/ST Raider [13k ES, 60k BF/265k GMP ST DPS, Stun-immune] [4 sec Chayula kill]

"

Cruxation wrote:

I figured, I'd give you a quick update on my character since we had a lot of back and forth recently. I have found/bought some pretty good gear and totally changed my build. I am now spectral throw and i have gone non crit. I have found the build to be a lot "cleaner" the pathing is very natural to get projectile damage and lots of int. I have outlined major stats below if your curious. I don't find the damage to be much more than crit though but defensively I gained a lot. US and much more int which = ES. Also ST seems a lot safer than BF but it may just be my playstyle. I feel the clear speed is better for sure though.

I'd like to find a neck, belt, and glove upgrade in the future. Accuracy on gloves and neck would be great or WED on the neck. For the belt I would love a crystal belt to try to hit 10k ES.

9.5k ES with discipline up
1,210 int (could have better rolls on HoWAs as well)
ele weakness capped on all res
84% chance to hit (i need to work on this)
27k tooltip ST+GMP+EF+WED+LP+AddL with only HoT and Wrath
67k tooltip with 8 frenzies and ele overload up
97k tooltip with flasks up as well

I switch GMP for slow proj for boss fights where it makes sense. I have to say being stun immune and immune to ele status is unreal and I absolutely love it especially while phasing. Very little slows this build down. The best part is my defenses are pretty set and all my next nodes will be offensive (lightning nodes in witch area, proj damage in shadow, proj/attack speed/accuracy in duelist). I also have levels on gems and quality on added lightning as well so even more room to gain damage. I am lvl 89 ATM.

Yup, agree that for raider the natural and easier path is to go for ST and non-crit because of the proximity of %dmg projectile nodes. Going BF and crit is very much of an oddity, but the elemental status immunity is just too good to resist.

I've leveled an inquisitor version of my otherwise raider build with pretty much the same skill tree and which also has about 1200 INT and almost 12k ES. It deals way more damage (tooltip dps-wise because you get an extra gem to use, being able to avoid using lightning pen) but man, being unaffected by status ailments ( I went pious path) simply isn't the same as being immune to status ailments, so in that regard the raider is better.

A few points I would like to mention:
If you choose to go ST, crit is for sure not the way to go, simply because the disemboweling cluster will not apply to your ST damage, and that for me is the one big advantage crit has over non crit, and also why crit BF > non-crit BF in the long run with good gear, and thus why crit ST < non-crit ST. My inquisitor version has about 65% crit Chance without power charges, which the raider version should also be able to reach. Crit also enables shock if you avoid elemental focus, which may result in lower tooltip dps but higher actual damage.

Try to get 3 pieces of gear with 300+ accuracy, should bring ur total accuracy to 3k which will be enough

just an update on this version just in case you guys thought i abandoned it (i haven't, just been busy playing the inquis version).

Currently sitting at 11k ave damage with 7.09 APS in hideout without any charges. will update you guys with further stats once I level abut more.

Projected damage in a few levels (based on my calculations) with my 5 frenzy and 3 power charges, using incr. AOE and lightning pen will be approx >22k with an APS of 6.4 which, as i suspected, would put its damage above that of non-crit variants.

Been debating about playing this build over Scourge Crit BF version. Do you by any chance know the pros and cons of both builds?

"

renroval wrote:

Been debating about playing this build over Scourge Crit BF version. Do you by any chance know the pros and cons of both builds?

I think the scourge crit BF version is the ultimate glass cannon. true, you'll reach astronomical dps numbers with heavy gear investment, but your survivability will be kinda meh.

HoWA on the other hand allows you to have balanced dps and survivability with a fraction of the budget. With regards to HoWA BF, imho inquisitor is the best.

Here's a mini boss montage of my inquisitor if you're interested:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oINQXhLFiP4&t=1s

DPS is respectable. Not super duper high, but not something to be sniffed at either. No costly expensive uniques aside from the claws (which were originally 9-10c and still are I think?). Gear still has room for improvement which can still bring ES much higher.

"

Invalesco wrote:

"

renroval wrote:

Been debating about playing this build over Scourge Crit BF version. Do you by any chance know the pros and cons of both builds?

I think the scourge crit BF version is the ultimate glass cannon. true, you'll reach astronomical dps numbers with heavy gear investment, but your survivability will be kinda meh.

HoWA on the other hand allows you to have balanced dps and survivability with a fraction of the budget. With regards to HoWA BF, imho inquisitor is the best.

Here's a mini boss montage of my inquisitor if you're interested:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oINQXhLFiP4&t=1s

DPS is respectable. Not super duper high, but not something to be sniffed at either. No costly expensive uniques aside from the claws (which were originally 9-10c and still are I think?). Gear still has room for improvement which can still bring ES much higher.

Would Raider also work or is Inquisitor that much better?

"

renroval wrote:

"

Invalesco wrote:

"

renroval wrote:

Been debating about playing this build over Scourge Crit BF version. Do you by any chance know the pros and cons of both builds?

I think the scourge crit BF version is the ultimate glass cannon. true, you'll reach astronomical dps numbers with heavy gear investment, but your survivability will be kinda meh.

HoWA on the other hand allows you to have balanced dps and survivability with a fraction of the budget. With regards to HoWA BF, imho inquisitor is the best.

Here's a mini boss montage of my inquisitor if you're interested:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oINQXhLFiP4&t=1s

DPS is respectable. Not super duper high, but not something to be sniffed at either. No costly expensive uniques aside from the claws (which were originally 9-10c and still are I think?). Gear still has room for improvement which can still bring ES much higher.

Would Raider also work or is Inquisitor that much better?

Raider is more agile and has faster movement speed due to the phasing mechanic. But inquisitor is just that much better in terms of clear speed and dps imo

As promised, here are the stats to prove that Crit > Non-Crit, based on the Level 93 (I know the screenshot says that I'm level 89 but that's because I speccced out of the leech nodes to place them in crit nodes so I don't have to level my raider further and can go back to my inquisitor)

Stats based on a 6L of:

BF - WED - Faster Attacks - Elemental Focus - Lightning Pen - Incr. AOE


Stats based on a 5L of:

BF - WED - Elemental Focus - Incr. Crit Strikes - Incr. AOE (the 6th link will be lightning pen ofc)


Do take note that these stats do not include my blasphemied Assassin's Mark which boosts my crit chance by another flat 9% and also increases the amount of damage the monsters receive by another 20%.

Also, the 5L version doesn't have a 20q Lightning Pen linked to it to boost its damage further (10% incr. lightning damage from 20q lightning pen)

Best links:
BF - WED - Incr. Crit Strikes - Incr. AOE - Lightning Pen - Elemental Focus/Incr. Crit Dmg


Gear

But wait, if you think these DPS figures are good, remember that an inquisitor will still be better simply because of the extra gem slot (inquisitors won't have to reply on the lightning pen gem). Inquisitors also get to have extra 100% crit chance/45% crit multi which does not reflect on their tooltip DPS.


In summary, in terms of DPS for HoWA:
Inquisitor Crit BF > Raider Crit BF > Raider Non-Crit BF = Raider Non-Crit ST


edit: link to my inquisitor version

"

Invalesco wrote:

As promised, here are the stats to prove that Crit > Non-Crit, based on the Level 93 (I know the screenshot says that I'm level 89 but that's because I speccced out of the leech nodes to place them in crit nodes so I don't have to level my raider further and can go back to my inquisitor)

Stats based on a 6L of:

BF - WED - Faster Attacks - Elemental Focus - Lightning Pen - Incr. AOE

Damage in Hideout

Damage with Power + Frenzy Charges

Stats based on a 5L of:

BF - WED - Elemental Focus - Incr. Crit Strikes - Incr. AOE (the 6th link will be lightning pen ofc)

Damage in Hideout

Damage with Power + Frenzy Charges

Do take note that these stats do not include my blasphemied Assassin's Mark which boosts my crit chance by another flat 9% and also increases the amount of damage the monsters receive by another 20%.

Also, the 5L version doesn't have a 20q Lightning Pen linked to it to boost its damage further (10% incr. lightning damage from 20q lightning pen)

Best links:
BF - WED - Incr. Crit Strikes - Incr. AOE - Lightning Pen - Elemental Focus/Incr. Crit Dmg


Gear

Spoiler

But wait, if you think these DPS figures are good, remember that an inquisitor will still be better simply because of the extra gem slot (inquisitors won't have to reply on the lightning pen gem). Inquisitors also get to have extra 100% crit chance/45% crit multi which does not reflect on their tooltip DPS.


In summary, in terms of DPS for HoWA:
Inquisitor Crit BF > Raider Crit BF > Raider Non-Crit BF = Raider Non-Crit ST


edit: link to my inquisitor version

kind of unfair to compare it the way you did.

1. Inquisitor doesn't have extra gem slot compared to raider - you don't need to use lightning pen but your attack speed sucks and you need FA , while raider do not need it thanks to frenzies.

2.You build Crit-based Raider , that relies/based on frenzy charges and consistent crits to scale damage (not counting specific HoWa int scaling) and took only 5 frenzy and 3 pc(judging by your dps screens)? That's rough man.

I have 93 inquisitor and 88 raider , damage is not much different overall imo , but raider is absolutely superior to play compared to inquisitor.
You are super fast , status immune ( this one is very huge QoL) , perma phasing ,having more natural pathing over the tree from ranger start etc etc.

On the other hand on Templar u'll need to recast orb of storms every 4 sec to maintain 50%damage buff regardless of having/not having skyforth to generate charges which will annoy the shit out of you(trust me), u're fragile to freezes and will need to tp out every 10 seconds on bosses like hydra because u'll get frozen and die if no unfreeze flasks available

And also you can't abuse unique flasks on inquisitor because atleast unfreeze and remove- shock flasks required while on raider you can use vinktar + atziri's promise + dying sun + diamond with curse immune + something(silver prolly) with remove bleed.
Just my 2c , both versions are pretty good , I've killed everything with both on a fairly low budget :)

Here's the gear I've used on both inquis and raider characters - nothing too crazy but more then enough to facetank shaper/ down uber atziri with ease

"

ssMETALURGss wrote:

"

Invalesco wrote:

As promised, here are the stats to prove that Crit > Non-Crit, based on the Level 93 (I know the screenshot says that I'm level 89 but that's because I speccced out of the leech nodes to place them in crit nodes so I don't have to level my raider further and can go back to my inquisitor)

Stats based on a 6L of:

BF - WED - Faster Attacks - Elemental Focus - Lightning Pen - Incr. AOE

Damage in Hideout

Damage with Power + Frenzy Charges

Stats based on a 5L of:

BF - WED - Elemental Focus - Incr. Crit Strikes - Incr. AOE (the 6th link will be lightning pen ofc)

Damage in Hideout

Damage with Power + Frenzy Charges

Do take note that these stats do not include my blasphemied Assassin's Mark which boosts my crit chance by another flat 9% and also increases the amount of damage the monsters receive by another 20%.

Also, the 5L version doesn't have a 20q Lightning Pen linked to it to boost its damage further (10% incr. lightning damage from 20q lightning pen)

Best links:
BF - WED - Incr. Crit Strikes - Incr. AOE - Lightning Pen - Elemental Focus/Incr. Crit Dmg


Gear

Spoiler

But wait, if you think these DPS figures are good, remember that an inquisitor will still be better simply because of the extra gem slot (inquisitors won't have to reply on the lightning pen gem). Inquisitors also get to have extra 100% crit chance/45% crit multi which does not reflect on their tooltip DPS.


In summary, in terms of DPS for HoWA:
Inquisitor Crit BF > Raider Crit BF > Raider Non-Crit BF = Raider Non-Crit ST


edit: link to my inquisitor version

kind of unfair to compare it the way you did.

1. Inquisitor doesn't have extra gem slot compared to raider - you don't need to use lightning pen but your attack speed sucks and you need FA , while raider do not need it thanks to frenzies.

2.You build Crit-based Raider , that relies/based on frenzy charges and consistent crits to scale damage (not counting specific HoWa int scaling) and took only 5 frenzy and 3 pc(judging by your dps screens)? That's rough man.

I have 93 inquisitor and 88 raider , damage is not much different overall imo , but raider is absolutely superior to play compared to inquisitor.
You are super fast , status immune ( this one is very huge QoL) , perma phasing ,having more natural pathing over the tree from ranger start etc etc.

On the other hand on Templar u'll need to recast orb of storms every 4 sec to maintain 50%damage buff regardless of having/not having skyforth to generate charges which will annoy the shit out of you(trust me), u're fragile to freezes and will need to tp out every 10 seconds on bosses like hydra because u'll get frozen and die if no unfreeze flasks available

And also you can't abuse unique flasks on inquisitor because atleast unfreeze and remove- shock flasks required while on raider you can use vinktar + atziri's promise + dying sun + diamond with curse immune + something(silver prolly) with remove bleed.
Just my 2c , both versions are pretty good , I've killed everything with both on a fairly low budget :)

Here's the gear I've used on both inquis and raider characters - nothing too crazy but more then enough to facetank shaper/ down uber atziri with ease

Spoiler

1. I don't calculate my figures based on average damage alone. I calculate based on avg damage * attacks per second to give a more accurate assessment of dps, and inquisitor is superior. Faster attacks provides 54% increased attack speed. The last I saw, a raider even with frenzy charges up will not have >54% attack speed compared to an inquis, especially if the inquis runs blood rage and generated their own frenzy charges as well, which they can do so because the 4% ES regent from pious path counteracts blood rage's defense.

2. Have you done any maths at all regarding the crit based version of a raider? I dislike having to rely on power charges, hence I didn't bother taking more than the base 3. Why should I do so, when I can just rely on my tree for reliable crit chance? Also, stacking frenzy charges is overrated. Frenzy charges are worth it for 1 point, but not for 2. The only reason non-crit builds go for stacking frenzy charges is because they reach the build ceiling so quickly that they have no better ways to spend their skill points, because very other useful notable is just too far away. Crit on the other hand has crit notables well within access. If you do your maths and attempt to min-max you will realise what I'm talking about.

No offense to you, but I've seen your inquisitor'a build. It's not at all a well-planned/optimized build for crit HoWA. Therefore u should not use if for comparison sake. My inquisitor and raider use very similar tree builds so my comparison is way more accurate. I agree that status ailment immune is a huge plus, which was why I took pious path on inquisitor. Granted, it's not as good as avatar of the veil, but it's not that big an advantage for raider that you would have me imagine. The only difference is that I use a flask for dispelling frozen on inquisitor. The other advantage u had which is movement speed I will not contest. That is definitely a plus point for raider, in the long run however, with whirling blades and the faster clear speed for inquis, it is not however as significant as you might think.

3. I don't use instruments of virtue. I don't need to when my DPS is already so high. So your argument about having to recast abilities, status ailments etc actually doesn't apply to me as much.

4. With regards to unique flasks, I can definitely use dying sun if I wish, I just find it too expensive at the moment. I use two consecrated flasks and have 2 remove bleed flasks so can definitely replace one of them with dying sun. Already am using vinktars.

If you want to, you can try respecting your inquisitor and use my inquisitor's skill tree instead. You'll see a world of difference I assure you.

Watching that video, you deleted a lot of the bosses quickly.

I'm still on the fence though whether or not to go scourge or HOWA. Scourge deletes stuff faster too but are there really any bosses that need that much damage to kill?

Also, how well does this build scale with gear? Can it reach the heights of the Scourge damage? Or close to?

Do you think wearing an Abyssus is a downside for Scourge builds?