PvP Balance and Damage Scaling

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Dos_Fafner wrote:

I have a few high end evade/dodge characters and the random hits that do get through back-to-back (keeping in mind I have closer to 60% attack dodge 30% spell dodge with 55% evade and 50% block 4.5k+ HP) almost kill them in high level maps. So letting another 15% of the hits through (roughly) will likely actually kill them. The right side of the tree has nearly no regeneration and dodging kills 50% of both ES and Armor already - all you have left is block. It's not the strong 30% NERF that makes this a terrible balance - it's this nerf COUPLED with a nerf or elimination of EVERY block node on the right side of the tree (except 1 which takes 5 points to get). So instead of getting: 30% (average) from your shield and 20% (average) from your tree you're getting 30% (again average) from your shield and 9% from your tree - which is then cut down 30% for a grand block total of 27% - that's assuming you invest at least 7-10 points in getting to/acquiring block nodes. Furthermore, getting 50% spell dodge and using Lightning Coil is ITEM reliant - this means it's the actual items, not the tree, that need balanced. As per usual, high end uniques with overpowered mods are driving balancing - this is counter-intuitive. Uniques should be designed and balanced around the tree - not the other way around. We ALL have the tree to work with, only top-end players consistently have top-end uniques to work with.

That being said, I'm just ignoring the crap block nodes and re-balancing my evasion builds based on not having significant block.

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Howmakeagame wrote:

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NeroNoah wrote:

Not to be an asshole, but I hope that level of balance filter its way out to pve, =D

If you just read the damn thing...

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sybrwookie wrote:

Sorry guys, but this is a horrible way to handle this. This is FAR too much math to make this work. You should have just done a MUCH simpler thing:

1) Players' PvP health/ES = Players' normal Health/ES * X
2) Damage Resistance++


Make it easy for people to understand. There's no way in hell I'm going to try to make sense of all that, and the people who are really into PvP, will, which means I'll just constantly lose, which means there's no point in me even bothering.

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sybrwookie wrote:

Sorry guys, but this is a horrible way to handle this. This is FAR too much math to make this work. You should have just done a MUCH simpler thing:

1) Players' PvP health/ES = Players' normal Health/ES * X
2) Damage Resistance++


Make it easy for people to understand. There's no way in hell I'm going to try to make sense of all that, and the people who are really into PvP, will, which means I'll just constantly lose, which means there's no point in me even bothering.

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Lucid_ wrote:

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wow u guys are actually doing the whole

IT DEALS THIS AMOUNT OF DAMAGE IN PVP
WE WON'T FUCK WITH IT IN PVE

Route

Good on you.

Except killing block

And the duelist starting..

And the witch starting...

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Waves_blade wrote:

Interesting.

Math hurts my head.

TBH though, considering that everyone will probably have a movement skill, idk why you even bothered with flameblast, its 0% viable against any kind of mobility IMO.

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p0t wrote:

Block needed a nerf it has nothing to do with PvP.

The amount of QQ defending block, because naturally we all use it, just strengthens the case against block. Its currently over used and makes builds less viable by being insanely too good compared to any other defensive option.

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elvy wrote:

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sybrwookie wrote:

Sorry guys, but this is a horrible way to handle this. This is FAR too much math to make this work. You should have just done a MUCH simpler thing:

1) Players' PvP health/ES = Players' normal Health/ES * X
2) Damage Resistance++


Make it easy for people to understand. There's no way in hell I'm going to try to make sense of all that, and the people who are really into PvP, will, which means I'll just constantly lose, which means there's no point in me even bothering.

It's ok, you'll be able to copy the more intelligent players later on, don't worry about a thing. Or just trust that GGG didn't fuck up any scaling and go with what you like. Or playtest everything and ignore theory. You know, putting some sort of work into it, whatever you can handle.

And if you are more dexterous than they are more intelligent you may even best them in the field!

edit: As a sidenote, the reaction of some people to this manifesto post is why big companies hire PR people to handle news and announcements. They'd have made sure to clarify the reasons for the block nerf a week+ before any sort of announcement containing the words 'PvP' and 'block builds', or any connection between the two.

How about the life nerf guys? Or the life buff? Or the ES buff? Or the ES nerf? Or the crit buff/nerf? Or the IR keystone severe nerf a while ago? Was that all PvP related too? Guess devs aren't allowed to make any changes to the tree if the patch focus is PvP or you'll be out to get them, huh.