Arc

Arc can be a useful skill if you link it with elemental proliferation, with 10% base chance to shock plus the 10%+ from conductivity and the +20% from the nodes it's really easy to stack shock 3 times on mobs even out screen. In this configuration it is even an ok-ish dps spell even in Merciless.

But I agree that you can't really do more with it since it's not a projectile spell you can't use LMP/GMP which are massive (and nearly mandatory) spell booster, and the low damage effectivness, crit chance and high mana cost make any support gem too costly for nearly nothing.

TBH I would like the damage effectivness to be raised to 80%, or that chain doesn't give damage penality when linked to Arc, or that Arc become a projectile spell.

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_Madus wrote:

Hello Mark,

Can you check my math about ARC spell because now i found linking ARC with chain support gem like DMG lose. What is lil bit strange especialy when its like only support gem for that spell what is changing mechanic, while for every other spell its gain.

So we have there 3 spells:
1 single target shot (read STS) with 500 dmg = 500 dmg sum
1 Lighting strike with 500 dmg per projectil = 1500 dmg sum
1 ARC with 500 dmg per hit = 1500 dmg sum

Now we apply chain support gem (50% less damage):
1 STS going from 500 to 250+250+250 = 750 dmg = 150% DMG done
1 LS projectils going from 500/projectil to (250+250+250)*3 = 2250 = 150%
1 ARC going from 500/per hit to 250+250+250+250+250 = 1250 = 80%

If we wanna normalize ARC with other spells it would need chain for every hit what ARC doing what is 250+250+250+250+250+250+250+250+250 = 2250

So is my math incorrect, or this spell is basicaly unfairly nerfed vs any other spell there.

PS:Sry for engrish not native speaker :)

Was this verified by someone? Chain (lvl 1) actually reduces the total amount of dmg on arc?

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Daumen wrote:

"

_Madus wrote:

Hello Mark,

Can you check my math about ARC spell because now i found linking ARC with chain support gem like DMG lose. What is lil bit strange especialy when its like only support gem for that spell what is changing mechanic, while for every other spell its gain.

So we have there 3 spells:
1 single target shot (read STS) with 500 dmg = 500 dmg sum
1 Lighting strike with 500 dmg per projectil = 1500 dmg sum
1 ARC with 500 dmg per hit = 1500 dmg sum

Now we apply chain support gem (50% less damage):
1 STS going from 500 to 250+250+250 = 750 dmg = 150% DMG done
1 LS projectils going from 500/projectil to (250+250+250)*3 = 2250 = 150%
1 ARC going from 500/per hit to 250+250+250+250+250 = 1250 = 80%

If we wanna normalize ARC with other spells it would need chain for every hit what ARC doing what is 250+250+250+250+250+250+250+250+250 = 2250

So is my math incorrect, or this spell is basicaly unfairly nerfed vs any other spell there.

PS:Sry for engrish not native speaker :)

Was this verified by someone? Chain (lvl 1) actually reduces the total amount of dmg on arc?

Seems to be the case. It's why I haven't bothered buying Chain for Arc. I'd rather get other stuff for it.

The problem I am seeing with arc is this:

On the Character sheet the wording for arc is this "Spell Total Combined Damage". If the wording is how the spell actually behaves then this is what happens.

I am currently lvl 34 with a level 6 arc and I dont have any support gems linked to it for this purpose.

The character sheet says:
Spell Total Combined Damage: 6-106
Hoving over the spell it says: 8-152 (which after looking at it is probably before the 50% damage effectiveness is applied)

But I am going to go with the character sheet. Lets says you get an extremely unlucky roll on your arc cast on three targets and get the lowest roll with no crits. The total damage will be 6 so each target will take 2 damage.

On the other hand say we get the highest roll of 106 damage on three targets. According to the wording that damage would be divided by 3. So each target would take 35.3 damage.

This is where its AoE and single target come up short. On 3 targets you can only do 2-35 damage to each and on single target you are only doing 2-35. So in my opinion the spell damage wording is miss leading and the spell doesnt do enough damage.

Against two targets this spell does well because you are getting the full damage against both targets. Others in this thread have said that spark does better, well it is because spark has the potential to hit 1 target for the full damage amount. Whereas Arc only has the potential to hit 1 target for 2/3rds the full damage amount. (But needs two targets to do this. And yes arc bounces off the primary target to the 2nd and back to the primary.)

For arc to compete with spark it needs to have a way to hit a single target for the full damage amount. When that target is the only one available. Or have its damage re tuned to work with its current mechanic. Because simply put both spark and arc work differently to put out their damage.

Edit: I guess the question is what was arc intended for AoE, single target, or both?

Total combined damage is a term they use to sum up every source of damage combined. In some cases, mostly attacks but with supports spells too, you will have various sources of damage, such as the main spell x-y dmg and then lightning damage v-w or whatever. These are all listed one by one, then there's a total combined damage line to see what's the total without having to bust the calculator out.

The damage listed is PER TARGET. It does take into account the 50% efficiency penalty though, which is why it's lower than the value shown on the gem directly(which is the base dmg, before the efficiency is taken into account).

It does pretty good damage, assuming you hit 2 and especially if you hit 3. It does fairly terrible single target damage though. Kinda wish concentrated effect would work on this, by reducing the range of the chains, would help quite a lot for single target.

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PyrosEien wrote:

Kinda wish concentrated effect would work on this, by reducing the range of the chains, would help quite a lot for single target.

This, I think, is an excellent idea. Skills like spark, that have a lot of possible support gem combinations, can be adjusted for use on single target or multi-target based on the gems used. Arc, on the other hand, is stuck in this weird optimized 3-5 target position and can't break out of it and even then, chain is incredibly mana-intensive and not viable for many arc builds. I think with enough support gem options arc could be brought in line (like spark) to be changed to fit a witch's arsenal. A pure light witch might consider arc for a ranged 1-2 target skill with concentrated effect and run spork for their multi-target. Or, if chain were a bit more friendly to arc, a chain arc with ele proliferation to provide a solid and safe multi target skill while running spark with pure damage gems for single target. This big thing that arc needs right now is a place within a witch's arsenal beyond shock spreading and I think more effective support gems would be the way to go.

Of course, the two big things that have to be addressed for something like this to work would be the base mana cost and the spell effectiveness ratio on it. With such a low crit chance and such a high mana cost and the 50% effectiveness rate it shares with spark, there aren't a lot of options to greatly increase the damage of arc outside of cast speed (incredibly mana intensive, but doable with the right gear) and gem level (gear intensive). I think reevaluating the base stats of arc and the support gem combinations would be its saving grace.

It is possible to get arc to do some great damage right now, but it requires an awful lot of gear, cast speed nodes, and mana regen nodes, and mana nodes. (EB builds and blood magic are possible as well) Arc has a lot of potential, like its excellent range, but at the same time it also has some of the limitations of a projectile (you really can only choose the direction of it, e.g. trying to hit the necromancer boss in catacombs if you roll it.) For projectile spells, this isn't really an issue due to the supports that can accompany it and I think if arc had better support options it wouldn't be either.

For those who don't want to read my endless drivel: Arc needs more support options for it to be malleable enough to be the kind of skill that it needs to be and it also needs a reevaluation of the mana cost and spell effectiveness(maybe) as well to make it work.

I like that it's different from the other projectile spells- natural chaining and auto-aiming give it a different feel to the other spells. It's got some decent support potential, with elemental proliferation, crit chance and crit damage (with some epic gear, anyway). There's also the utility supports that don't add mana cost, like stun, blind and chance to flee that work well on spamming skills. The problem is most of the core damage boosters other skills rely on (ie, LMP/GMP) don't work here, so essentially you're dealing with the base spell all the way through the game.

I think 3 main thinks will bring it into line: Reduce mana cost (to make it spammable and compensate for it's mediocre damage), Reduce cast time slightly (spamming), and raise the minimum damage as the gem levels (to increase the DPS average as level increases). It's uniqueness should do the rest.

Very nice idea to make the damage based on how many targets it chains too.

i love arc. i dont have any problem with the damage.

im now in Act2 Merci and im farming Fellshire. lvl65

i got 1000 DPS with Faster Cast and Quantity&Rarity linked.

I play an Marauder Spellcaster with wand/spelldmg shield. I got some amulet with cast speed too. Some Lightning Nodes. I using Bloodmagic as passiv so i dont have mana problems.

When i finish my build and i get an 5l i will link:
Arc-Faster Cast-Lightning Penetration- Ironwill-Added Lightning Dmg. Curse i use conductivity and an taunt totem for some situations. maybe i will build an frostnova totem and get Elemental Eq passive.

http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/129202/page/1/#p1210305

ARC Gems states it does 3-59 but due to the 50% effectiveness its actual damage is 3-29.
The gem in its description LIES to the user, becuase it could just say 3-29 and dont even put the damage effectiveness.

What's the point of showing the damage effectivness at 50% and higher base damage, if you could just show its ACTUAL damage?
That's just lying in the gem description outright, there's no reason for it. It's counter intuitive and in my opinion just plain stupid.

Instead of :

ARC Level 1-
Damage effectiveness : 50%
Damage : 3-59

It should be :

ARC Level 1-
Damage 3-29

And there would be no confusion, also i think it's damage is way too low at lvl1.
I hit way harder with freezing pulse, and i hit more enemies, and if there's only 1 enemy i dont lose any effectiveness. it has nothing on the other spells. its just worse. straight up worse.

That's my feedback and my opinion. I don't doubt people make it work, but i'm sure the same guy a with same gear using Fireball with supports, or freezing pulse with supports is better.