ScrotieMcB vs Desync Dev Manifesto (Massive Wall Map of Text)
"I played Diablo 3 enough to know that this wasn't true; I could and did routinely avoid melee blows by getting out of the way. An entire monster was actually based around this mechanic; his attack animation was like a full 2-3 seconds and hit like a mack truck, the idea was to get out of the way before contact was made. Makes me wonder why you'd say something like this. When Stephen Colbert was killed by HYDRA's Project Insight in 2014, the comedy world lost a hero. Since his life model decoy isn't up to the task, please do not mistake my performance as political discussion. I'm just doing what Steve would have wanted. Last edited by ScrotieMcB#2697 on Aug 24, 2013, 9:06:59 PM
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" You are wrong. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WsuJXNeLm-4&t=0m25s Never underestimate what the mod community can do for PoE if you sell an offline client.
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" It is you who is wrong. Here is a quote from Bashiok on the D3 forums. FYI it is this post that made me leave D3, I hated their hit detection and Bashiok's comments on how 'dodging isn't fun' made me boil over with rage. This is what you are advocating in this thread. It is a horrible idea. If POE will always have desync due to double check hit detection I will take that any day over what we had in D3. " Link to OP |
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" No, he's not. A lot of monster abilities were designed so you couldn't avoid them after they had begun. For some obscure reason, they wanted this. But also many were designed so you could. Berserkers and Beasts to name a couple. Casually casual.
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Here, another video of d3 combat fail:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZ8D89Rd5No Edit: removed Bashiok quote, since someone posted it just prior. Never underestimate what the mod community can do for PoE if you sell an offline client. Last edited by Vhlad#6794 on Aug 24, 2013, 9:48:47 PM
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" Fluid attacks could not be dodged. Gimmicky avoid the red circle mechanics could. Never underestimate what the mod community can do for PoE if you sell an offline client.
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Wow am I glad I never tried diablo 3, I mean I don't think you should be able to dodge everything, stand at range and spam (that is, I far prefer being overwhelmed and having to do all kinds of shit to deal with situations). But if I actually manage to visually dodge something, it had better fucking dodge. Problem is, that's not exactly the case in PoE either and also far less predictable.
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"If it's not "attacks could not be manually avoided" but instead "some attacks could not be manually avoided," then it no longer supports the theory that D3's netcode was to blame. Clearly their netcode could support both attacks which were manually avoidable and those which weren't; it was a deliberate mechanics decision on the part of the designers, not a netcode flaw. Why would Blizzard/Bashiok defend this kind of mechanics decision, when other content proves that they weren't thoroughly committed to the principle anyway? Why not just scale monster attack speeds so that some are easy to avoid, and others much harder to borderline (but not quite) impossible? Beats me. But it obviously wasn't a technical limitation; it was done on purpose. Which means, in terms of the actual topic, I wasn't wrong in claiming that D3's "wait on the server" netcode is possible for an Action RPG. I still believe it's not optimal, so we're really splitting hairs here anyway. When Stephen Colbert was killed by HYDRA's Project Insight in 2014, the comedy world lost a hero. Since his life model decoy isn't up to the task, please do not mistake my performance as political discussion. I'm just doing what Steve would have wanted. Last edited by ScrotieMcB#2697 on Aug 25, 2013, 12:00:29 AM
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ScrotieMcB:
I can't respond with a point-by-point reply to your analysis of my sync article, but I believe from your reply that I must not have explained certain points well enough in my initial article. I can see that you have a good understanding of the general case of why maintaining server-authoritative sync across latency is difficult, and you have a clear passion to want Path of Exile's sync code to be improved, but your criticisms of my article show that I have not properly communicated how and why our system works as it does. I honestly feel that people are unfairly critical of this system considering it's probably one of the most advanced ones that has had to be made for an action RPG of this type. While it certainly has its flaws and can cause some terrible gameplay experiences, it does allow PoE to be one of two Action RPGs that allows zero client manipulation of combat results. The point is somewhat moot though, because we do have substantial changes coming up to deploy to the production realm in the coming weeks. I'd rather get those done than spend ages arguing about semantics :) The changes to map generation so that the client doesn't have the entire map in memory will be some time in their implementation. I acknowledged the issue, and scheduled a fix, but it's large enough to not be on our horizon for the initial release which is rapidly approaching. Iin the meantime we have to rely continuing to ban people who run maphack software, rather than making their software less effective. It's a change I'd desperately love to see in, but is less important and more time consuming than other changes we have to have in by release. Such as better sync code. | |
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I read the entire post. This for everyone elses reference is how you should discuss desync. Not as if its completely broken, but more as if there is some issues wit hit.
I find the biggest issue at hte moment is monster sync. The sync for the client now seems a lot better tahn it used to, while it does desync (and can get better) its not as bad as it could be. But the monster sync, especially in areas like the prison, is just so bad, you end up sometimes struggling to kill a necromancer, not because he is hard, but because he keeps getting out of sync, along with being blocked by a lot of respawned monsters who then desync themselves. If they could make the monsters resync better, even if they ported, it would make combat less dangerous and better |
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