[Erased]

Bump

"

Zedda wrote:

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

Why? Because if players are fighting during battle and they're given the luxury to change instances whenever they want, it would create a terrible exploit in PoE. Using Portals for surviving bosses, etc. is bad enough.

The only difference is changing instances would be free without wasting Portal Scrolls, which would make it an even worse exploit.

What are you talking about? You'd only be able to do it when you're at an exit/entrance to another area, you can leave combat like this already in current PoE, so it'd make no difference.

Besides, what you said is irrelevant because PoE is supposed to be first about PvE, not about PvP.

Pardon the late reply.

What am I talking about? What are you talking about... *Laughs*

Where did PvP come into the picture here? We're not even talking about PvP.

A 'Change Instance' button at the top left-hand side of your screen available only when by the exit / entrance of an area makes no sense. IF you're already by an entrance / exit in an area, you may as well just change the instance like everyone does now by doing a CTRL + CLICK.

Sure, of course it's about PvE, but that still doesn't discredit everything I pointed out that's wrong with a 'Change Instance' button no matter where you are in an area. I also just pointed out what's wrong with the availability of a 'Change Instance' button only when by an area's exit / entrance (which is pointless.)

The 'Change Instance' button is strictly for towns only for good reason.

"

DirkAustin wrote:

Stop bumping this, GGG already makes a new trade system.

This has littler to do with trading and more to do with improving the Chat Window. You're not looking at the big picture here regarding what the OP is mainly about.

The details about improving Trade due to better instance management is just a bonus and does not in any way, shape, or form negatively affect the new trade improvements coming soon to PoE.

P.S. I have updated the very end of the OP and the OP title to reflect what I originally had in mind regarding instance management for towns only whether or not for the sake of quality-of-life or trade sessions.

Again, it is an annoyance (over time) to have to CTRL + CLICK the green town dots on the map in every Act just to bring up the instance menu for towns.

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

Where did PvP come into the picture here? We're not even talking about PvP.

You mentioned the word 'battle'. A battle implies PvP. Fightning monsters is hardly a 'battle', it's either a stomp or kiting. The term 'battle' in PvM is hardly appropriate.

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

A 'Change Instance' button at the top left-hand side of your screen available only when by the exit / entrance of an area makes no sense. IF you're already by an entrance / exit in an area, you may as well just change the instance like everyone does now by doing a CTRL + CLICK.

It makes complete sense.

Scenario 1: You and 5 other players have just finished farming Fellshrine. You click on the Church Dungeon entrance. All 6 of you wait for the dungeon to load. You're the party leader so once in the dungeon you ctrl+click the Fellshrine Ruins entrance. New. You wait for it to load. 5 other players wait for it to load. Then you play.

Scenario 2: You're in Fellshrine. You ctrl+click the dungeon entrance. Instead of going into the dungeon you just reset the current instance for yourself. Your party members ctrl+click the entrance shortly after and enter the new instance with you directly.

Cut out the middle man. Really, why do we need to go to a completely different area if we just intend to reset the current one?

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

Sure, of course it's about PvE

Wow. Okay. I'm sure contradicting yourself was a complete accident. But let's not talk about PvP any more here.

July 2013 and GGG still hasn't fixed the freaking Backspace issue where you go into Local?

GGG, this is like the #1 quality of life change you could make, and it would take you three minutes to solve it. Please do so, it's ridiculous that we even have to deal with this at all.

All suggestions in the OP are great. Would like to see them implemented.

"

Zedda wrote:

You mentioned the word 'battle'. A battle implies PvP. Fightning monsters is hardly a 'battle', it's either a stomp or kiting. The term 'battle' in PvM is hardly appropriate.

Pardon my late reply.

The definition of 'battle'

Are you really trying to refute the irrefutable by erroneously correcting me in my native language (English) on what the word battle means in how I used it in my sentence? Unless you can quote me I meant PvP (I did not,) I was not referring to PvP.

You seem to want to argue for the sake of arguing over something so trivial, over something I never implied.

If not the word battle, what else did you expect me to say, "If players are fighting when in a fighting zone..." or "If players are fighting when in a hostile area..."? It all leads to the same meaning, but I guess common sense was thrown out the window in that battling is what does go on in a hostile area in PoE between you and many other forces (not always just between you and one other player.)

The only thing the word battle implies in what I said is what you want it to imply through your assumption on something that's not really there.

Zedda quotes HeavyMetalGear:

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

A 'Change Instance' button at the top left-hand side of your screen available only when by the exit / entrance of an area makes no sense. IF you're already by an entrance / exit in an area, you may as well just change the instance like everyone does now by doing a CTRL + CLICK.

"

Zedda wrote:

It makes complete sense.

Pardon the misunderstanding on my end. It does make sense. I get what you're saying now. I thought you meant something else in that you were suggesting a 'Change Instance' button without a 'Instance Window.'

So what you're saying is allow there to be a 'Change Instance' button when an entrance / exit of an area recognizes players within the vicinity of the entrance / exit?

If so, I'm all for it, and I'll probably add that to my OP. The only reason I like that idea is because it does away with having to CTRL + CLICK to change instances in areas outside town.

That being said, if you're still contending to the below:

"

Zedda wrote:

Why towns only? When I'm doing fellshrine runs I hate needing to go to a new area each time I want to reset the instance. Why shouldn't we be able to reset them at the portal or entrance without leaving the area?

Then I disagree for reasons already stated.

However, what I find most contradicting about the above quoted is you seem to be suggesting instance resets by going through portals over and over again, yet you also seem to suggest instance resets by entrances / exits within areas outside towns.

Wouldn't going through entrances / exits within areas be the same as if you were to have to go to a new area to change instances? Perhaps I'm missing something here, but what you said in the above quoted doesn't add up.

Surely changing instances through portals again, and again (I'm against) has more freedom to it than changing instances when by entrances / exits in areas outside town. Which one is it you want?

Zedda quotes HeavyMetalGear:

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

Sure, of course it's about PvE

"

Zedda wrote:

Wow. Okay. I'm sure contradicting yourself was a complete accident. But let's not talk about PvP any more here.

There was no contradiction. Let's put things in the right order of events that lead me to say what I said.

"

Zedda wrote:

Besides, what you said is irrelevant because PoE is supposed to be first about PvE, not about PvP.

To which I replied:

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

Sure, of course it's about PvE...

Where is the contradiction in what I said? I am agreeing with you PoE is mainly about PvE, followed by me also saying the OP is not really about PvP, YET it just so happens the features I bring up regarding town instance management in my OP makes meeting up for Trade and PvP sessions easier.

"

Lord_Kamster wrote:

July 2013 and GGG still hasn't fixed the freaking Backspace issue where you go into Local?

GGG, this is like the #1 quality of life change you could make, and it would take you three minutes to solve it. Please do so, it's ridiculous that we even have to deal with this at all.

All suggestions in the OP are great. Would like to see them implemented.

Above everything in the OP, I agree the backspace issue should have been resolved long ago. Thank you for the support.

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

Are you really trying to refute the irrefutable by erroneously correcting me in my native language (English) on what the word battle means in how I used it in my sentence? Unless you can quote me I meant PvP (I did not,) I was not referring to PvP.

Wow, I can't believe you just went for the dictionary defense. Lame.

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

If not the word battle, what else did you expect me to say

Well let's see. How about "fighting monsters" or "attacking monsters" or "farming". These are common terms in online games.

If in real life you're a hunter with a rifle and you're shooting wild animals, do you call it a battle?
If in real life you're in the army and you're engaging an enemy camp, do you call it a battle?

No to the former, yes to the latter. Likewise, farming in PoE PvM is hardly a battle.

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

It does make sense. I get what you're saying now.

Well it was pretty obvious what I was saying. I even made it crystal clear in my last post. Allow resetting an instance from an entrance/exit to an area, and heck, why not allow it via waypoints as well? Not sure if that could be abused, but there's no harm in discussing it.

As for town portals? No. Unless someone can prove there is zero chance for abuse. I can see the devs implementing area resets using an area entrance/exit but not town portals. That would be called "being hopeful". Just like wishing for the trade to be completely removed from PoE. Removing trading (and simultaneously boosting decent drops) is a wonderful idea, but the devs are on their own mission with trading it seems.

"

Zedda wrote:

Why towns only? When I'm doing fellshrine runs I hate needing to go to a new area each time I want to reset the instance. Why shouldn't we be able to reset them at the portal or entrance without leaving the area?

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

Then I disagree for reasons already stated.

What reasons? There is no abuse in saving load time. I play off a ramdisk so my load times are pretty fast, but I used to play on a 5400rpm HDD and it was beyond painful. I imagine other players also find constantly going into a different area just to reset the current area painful at best.

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

However, what I find most contradicting about the above quoted is you seem to be suggesting instance resets by going through portals over and over again

No-where did I ever mention resetting an instance via town portal. You first brought it up and then because I didn't specifically negate my own support for the idea, you probably assumed that is what I was suggesting.

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

Wouldn't going through entrances / exits within areas be the same as if you were to have to go to a new area to change instances? Perhaps I'm missing something here, but what you said in the above quoted doesn't add up.

Saves load time. Why go to the dungeon if you're only wanting to be in Fellshrine? Perhaps what we need is endless areas then. You go into Fellshrine and the area continuously extends using procedural generation. Once again though, this would be being "hopeful" as the devs almost certainly won't implement dynamically extending an area this way.

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

Surely changing instances through portals again, and again (I'm against) has more freedom to it than changing instances when by entrances / exits in areas outside town.

More freedom, but more abuse. Moreover why would you change instances halfway through an area? Perhaps in dock runs when you get to the end of a wharf and you've already cleared all other areas. However you often need to go back to town any to sell junk.

"

HeavyMetalGear wrote:

There was no contradiction.

Sigh, nevermind then. You said PvE where I usually use the term PvM, so I misread it as PvP.

On an unrelated note, PvE makes no sense in mmo's (not claiming in any way that PoE is an mmo, but it uses a lot of similar terminology). You're fighting the environment? Is the wind out to get you? PvM makes a lot more sense.

Long time no reply. Pardon me for that.

Zedda quotes HeavyMetalGear:
"Are you really trying to refute the irrefutable by erroneously correcting me in my native language (English) on what the word battle means in how I used it in my sentence? Unless you can quote me I meant PvP (I did not,) I was not referring to PvP."

"

Zedda wrote:

Wow, I can't believe you just went for the dictionary defense. Lame.

It's not lame; it's the only way to get you to realize what I'm trying to get across. Since you don't believe anything I say, yeah, I used the dictionary against you to separate B.S. from fact.

"

Zedda wrote:

Well let's see. How about "fighting monsters" or "attacking monsters" or "farming". These are common terms in online games.

If in real life you're a hunter with a rifle and you're shooting wild animals, do you call it a battle?
If in real life you're in the army and you're engaging an enemy camp, do you call it a battle?

No to the former, yes to the latter. Likewise, farming in PoE PvM is hardly a battle.

PoE is not real life; that's thing #1. So yes, the monstrous, fantasy-like animals and such you face in PoE are really not that comparable to the outside world since what you encounter in a game whether in PoE or not is way more erratic and aggressive than in real life. Therefore, calling it a battle does make more sense in a game (not real life unless you're actually in a battle) because you're constantly battling legions of enemies.

Briefly put, what/who you encounter in-game is already your enemy; what/who you encounter in real life (more often than not) becomes your enemy if you make it/them your enemy.

"

Zedda wrote:

Well it was pretty obvious what I was saying. I even made it crystal clear in my last post. Allow resetting an instance from an entrance/exit to an area, and heck, why not allow it via waypoints as well? Not sure if that could be abused, but there's no harm in discussing it.

What you said was clear, and at the same time, not so clear.

You can already do a reset of an instance from a Waypoint (from town.) It would be quite illogical to have it work the other way around from the area you're in.

"

Zedda wrote:

As for town portals? No. Unless someone can prove there is zero chance for abuse. I can see the devs implementing area resets using an area entrance/exit but not town portals. That would be called "being hopeful". Just like wishing for the trade to be completely removed from PoE. Removing trading (and simultaneously boosting decent drops) is a wonderful idea, but the devs are on their own mission with trading it seems.

Getting rid of trade may be your wish and the wish of other PoE users, but not mine.

HeavyMetalGear quotes Zedda:
"Why towns only? When I'm doing fellshrine runs I hate needing to go to a new area each time I want to reset the instance. Why shouldn't we be able to reset them at the portal or entrance without leaving the area?"

Zedda quotes HeavyMetalGear:
"Then I disagree for reasons already stated."

"

Zedda wrote:

What reasons? There is no abuse in saving load time. I play off a ramdisk so my load times are pretty fast, but I used to play on a 5400rpm HDD and it was beyond painful. I imagine other players also find constantly going into a different area just to reset the current area painful at best.

This has nothing to do with saving load times *Laughs heartily* It has everything to do with abusing portals for instance switching over and over, especially if you're in tough boss battles (I mean, not that players don't already cheat enough by using portals.)

That's why. And here you're saying how clear you've been when I can say the same thing, but I guess I wasn't clear enough, either.

Zedda quotes HeavyMetalGear:
"However, what I find most contradicting about the above quoted is you seem to be suggesting instance resets by going through portals over and over again."

"

Zedda wrote:

No-where did I ever mention resetting an instance via town portal. You first brought it up and then because I didn't specifically negate my own support for the idea, you probably assumed that is what I was suggesting.

Yes you did. Surely you're not that blind. I will quote you again:

"

Zedda wrote:

Why towns only? When I'm doing fellshrine runs I hate needing to go to a new area each time I want to reset the instance. Why shouldn't we be able to reset them at the portal or entrance without leaving the area?

I did not assume that's what you suggested; it is what you suggested in plain English in the above underlined. Whether that was an accident or not, what you said is what it means, and I responded accordingly.

Zedda quotes HeavyMetalGear:
"Wouldn't going through entrances / exits within areas be the same as if you were to have to go to a new area to change instances? Perhaps I'm missing something here, but what you said in the above quoted doesn't add up.[/quote]

"

Zedda wrote:

Saves load time. Why go to the dungeon if you're only wanting to be in Fellshrine? Perhaps what we need is endless areas then. You go into Fellshrine and the area continuously extends using procedural generation. Once again though, this would be being "hopeful" as the devs almost certainly won't implement dynamically extending an area this way.

Touché.

Zedda quotes HeavyMetalGear:
"Surely changing instances through portals again, and again (I'm against) has more freedom to it than changing instances when by entrances / exits in areas outside town.[/quote]

"

Zedda wrote:

More freedom, but more abuse. Moreover why would you change instances halfway through an area? Perhaps in dock runs when you get to the end of a wharf and you've already cleared all other areas. However you often need to go back to town any to sell junk.

I get what you're saying regarding convenience with something like this, but you just proved my point by acknowledging abuse, which I am against when it can be avoided by not ever adding this portal capability in PoE.

Zedda quotes HeavyMetalGear:
"There was no contradiction."

"

Zedda wrote:

Sigh, nevermind then. You said PvE where I usually use the term PvM, so I misread it as PvP.

On an unrelated note, PvE makes no sense in mmo's (not claiming in any way that PoE is an mmo, but it uses a lot of similar terminology). You're fighting the environment? Is the wind out to get you? PvM makes a lot more sense.

On an unrelated note? It's not unrelated at all since what you're bringing up, again, is something that was brought up on your part in our discussion.

PvE = Player vs. Enemy not Player vs. Environment. (Where do you get the idea it meant that? *Laughs*)

PvM = Player vs. Monster.

Both acronyms are the same difference, just a different way of putting it.

Therefore, PvE makes plenty of sense to me.