[1.2.0] Ice Pierce Crit Ranger
" If you need to go into duelist side use this http://tinyurl.com/mjwb2ga Last edited by Whitesoula#0855 on Jul 23, 2013, 11:28:01 AM
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Sure. That works. I feel that that way still locks you out of too many potential HP nodes, but it works.
(Also because I actually was going for the mana nodes at the bottom, for myself. So I did not think about optimising it through that route on top. XD) How to make a build: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/510084 Current guides: N/A Last edited by Kirielis#6293 on Jul 23, 2013, 11:37:36 AM
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An update
Kiri what's you status with this build? What's your current level, gear and passives? How is it going? Last edited by nebunelux#1236 on Jul 23, 2013, 6:11:05 PM
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Strongly recommend multistrike for zombies/skele's to apply blind. Or just extra dmg, they work amazing with it.
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Edited first post to reflect current gear set. Level 78, character on hold for a few days as of the writing of this post. I did just clean up my entire pile of Reef (Asphyxia lol), Mud Geyser (spawns rhoas every time) and Ghetto (y'know, Reaver?) maps right before I started focusing on other characters. In other words, no trouble as yet, just Kiri being ADHD.
Passive tree? Mine's actually something of a work in progress, I'm not too happy with the way it looks right this moment. For the record - I pretty much rebuilt my passives and gear around the Voll's and the Torment once I had the opportunity to. Build works perfectly fine without them, and I have the 5L and nice rings to prove it, but I like this combination. It solves my mana problems without going BM. I had a word with Blastrophe (LA crit shadow) and he's given me some things to think about too. Namely, high quality Frenzy. More on that when, y'know, I actually get one. We also talked about Lioneye's Glare. He's an awesome fellow and you should take this time to check out his thread too. How to make a build: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/510084 Current guides: N/A Last edited by Kirielis#6293 on Jul 23, 2013, 8:35:57 PM
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" So is this the current build then? I am a bit green in this game still, and the initial post has a few different builds to follow, which don't all seem the same. What do you recommend? I'm not a theorycrafter, I just think this build sounds fun and want your advice :D |
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Hello,
I am trying to build a frenzy/ice shot ranger and have leveled up to 67 so far with various builds. I came across this thread, and I appreciate the insight/guidance within. Below is my take on a hybrid crit/survival ice shot build maximizing frenzy charges.
Spoiler
http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgIBr-vEotwVp9T-yKGk4dsk_edU1QAV8DpYBH6HGfljveY-z1FHMHxv8jnUoJ-NvwW11COxMIbOd9T5VgzypcvndG1sUzWbtcM6Vi2sf5uN034knWJatUhte1VLJpWMNgL-34T6sepivqduacS41fh08Z65LIVaGrZBapPV7cAP0k1h4jZ7y0Fyu-sU3sbNmBjb_MVW-megh3ZKfd0NW69_K6q4qn-NfZXIu-P-ut-YdEF31wgu7YMZjgBe1ooPqzY9
Of note is that this build is mana based with no blood magic (gem or keystone). Since there are many out there who think that such a thing is not possible, I will detail in spoiler below. This build is very slightly gear dependent and requires a very moderate mana, mana regen, and mana leech requirement on gear.
Spoiler
Mana cost per sec with ice shot linked with life on hit, faster attacks, lmp, wpn elemental or 16*1.5*1.5*1.15*1.7 = 70.38 mana/shot. Assuming 3 shots/sec, that's 211.14 mana sec. Mana boosts from build: 72% mana 100% mana regen Gear needs: 50 mana (can easily get on one piece of gear) 100% mana regen (can easily get on 2 pieces of gear) Enough mana leech to max leech rate (usually not a limiting factor as most rangers can max the leech rate, it's the size of the leech that's usually the limit) Assuming a lvl 75 character with 150 INT and +50 mana on gear somewhere (very reasonable), your mana pool will be 792. That gives 14 mana/sec with the base regen rate. Running a fully leveled Clarity gem gives 21.4 mana/sec for a total of 35 mana/sec. With the regen rate from the tree and gear, this turns into 105.83 mana/sec. Adding that to our max leech of 100 mana/sec based on our mana pool, we have 205.83 mana/sec coming in. Please correct me if I'm wrong anywhere... Why run off of mana instead of BM? Either auras or an extra support gem slot. Once you get your regen high enough, flasks are a non-issue, and speccing into in costs very few wasted skill points - about the same number you would take to get to the BM keystone. The other very big advantage to running skills off of mana is that my LoH and life leech are now healing me for 100% of their value instead of dedicating a significant portion of their hp recovery to BM. Crit % explained below
Spoiler
Your build has 470% to crit. Mine has 285%. Giving you a crit % (based on a 5% bow) of 28.50 before power charges. Mine is only 19.25. I chose to take Freeze for the 5% chance to freeze (bringing my freeze % up to 24.25) over the Assassination node to save some pts in the build. Is this build viable with 24.25% chance to freeze? Not sure, but we'll find out :) What did I gain by not speccing so heavily into crit? See next spoiler... Major build differences
Spoiler
Yours: 470% to crit 90% crit multiplies 47% attack speed 18% evasion 112% life 15% projectile dmg 2 Frenzy charges Mine: 285% chance to crit 0% crit multiplier 5% chance to freeze on hit 14% cold dmg 59% attk spd 82% evasion 138% life 35% projectile dmg 3 Frenzy charges As you can see, I lose 5% crit and 90% crit multiplier, but gain significant evasion/life/frenzy/attk spd/projectile dmg. I am also 3 pts less in the tree than you, and can slot those into Deadly Draw for 70% crit multiplier. I am a little unsure on whether crit multiplier is needed to get your crit high enough that it will freeze, or if it is just extra dps... Advice is appreciated. So there is my take on a mana-using, semi-survival frezy-ice shot freeze build. Please critique. Thanks, Tref |
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Changes made to the Build section. Updated Skills and Supports section to explain the effective difference between Frenzy and Burning Arrow. Clarified which kind of reflect damage I was talking about in the OP (it's both).
" I completely don't recommend you to follow the current build as I have it on my character at the moment. The core build listed (Frenzy or no Frenzy, your choice) will get you into merciless, and by that time you should have an idea of which of the remaining options you should choose. " The first thing I think is, good luck with that. Several points come to mind instantly. Please don't take this negatively, I spent a very long time theory crafting mana sustainability and would love it if your method worked - I just don't think it will. Please prove me wrong. I would love to be proven wrong. - Taking another look at your build, for 4 points you could get 5% reduced mana cost of skills, as well as 16% max mana. Worth it? Your decision. Similarly, at this point why not take EB as aimlessgun does? - Mana leech on gear, similar to life leech, does not work with the elemental portion of Ice Shot. I had the Mind Drinker node for a few levels, and it made no visible difference to IS, only to BA. - Chance to freeze is not at all the same thing as chance to crit...and I've got 47% or so with my crit bow, and our friend the LA crit shadow has 42% with his Glare. That is not at all the same as 28%. It is most certainly not the same as, or even similar to, 20% with added 5% to freeze without critting. - Not to mention, I have a ~500% crit multiplier. Yes, I did only get that far by having about 100% increased multiplier from gear. But my point stands, which is that crit is a major part of my damage. - And yes, kill speed is in fact important. - Where, exactly, will you be running this fully leveled Clarity gem? On your HP or on your mana? Clarity is the most expensive flat aura. In addition, where do you suppose you'll find a level 20 Clarity, and what will you do in the levels before you can use it? - Nodes spent on mana that could be spent elsewhere, perhaps? Opportunity cost is still a cost. - You are obviously using stats off the specific build on my specific character...which does not actually follow the OP to the letter. This right here is why I don't link my build in the OP - everything is customised, but I had to generalise it for the guide. - And as long as you're straight comparing with my character, two words: Thief's Torment. I have neither BM nor mana leech. I think I win. How to make a build: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/510084 Current guides: N/A Last edited by Kirielis#6293 on Jul 26, 2013, 3:52:25 PM
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Ok. You win.
I apologize if you thought I was being confrontational or trying to one-up you in my post - I just finished merciless and wanted some feedback on a mana variant of your build since I have about one/hundredth the experience you do with what works and what doesn't. My comparison was a description of trade-offs - I did not intend it to mean that my build was 'better' in any way. To respond specifically: I agree that 5% mana cost reduction is great, and that would be on my expansion, but I didn't want to post a 120 pt build. Not sure what I would have given up for it in the build I posted. Regarding EB, I was planning on going pure evasion and Acrobatics, which'll halve my ES anyway. I thought about it, but never actually planned a tree with EB in it. I understand that mana leech does not work with the cone. It does, however, work wonders with Pierce. I have only 2% mana leech on gear, yet I can spam a 7 frenzy charged IS with lmp, wpn elemental, and faster attacks on any group of more than about 3 mobs and never run out of mana because (I think) the fact that IS is piercing and hitting all the mobs behind for both physical and ele dmg (about 50% each with my current setup) allows for enough physical dps to sustain mana leech. I will detail my stats in the spoiler for anyone interested in how to possibly make a mana sustain ranger.
Spoiler
OK. One of my main focus in this build was to make an ele mana-based ranger. I'm still a noob, so please excuse any mistakes below. All I know is that it works, at least for now. What we need to make it work: Lots of mana regen from Clarity and gear (exact numbers depend on your setup, but approx 100 mana/sec) 2-4% mana leech on gear Relatively high mana pool (700-1000) An attack that does a good deal of physical dmg My gear is nowhere near even 'good', and I'm not at the levels above, but it works just fine (also because I only have IS on a 5L). Below are my current details. I have: 118 intelligence from passives and gear. 44 mana from my helm and 64% extra mana from the passive tree. Total mana pool: 681. This gives 12 mana/sec regen. Lvl 13 Clarity giving 14.9 mana/sec. 100% mana regen from the passive tree and 37% mana regen from one ring. Total mana/sec is 27*2.37 = 63. This number is below what I want, but sufficient for now. We'll need more to run a 6L IS. Right now, I run IS with lmp, wpn ele dmg and faster attacks. If I add 'added cold damage' (1.4 modifier), it's too much, so I stick with Blind, or swap wpn ele dmg for LoH and 'added cold damage', which is fine. This set up gives me an IS which costs 43 mana/shot, and at 2.76 shots/sec, I am using 121 mana/sec. The difference between use and regen is therefore 58. This is where mana leech (on gear, NOT the gem) comes in. I only have 2% total physical leech on my quiver. Each IS shot does 280 (avg) physical damage (I know, crappy gear...) With a 2% leech, that's 5.8 mana, and at 2.76 shots/sec, that's 16 mana leeched per target hit. To make up the 58 mana/sec I'm missing, I need to hit 3.63 mobs. This is why pierce works so well here - on any group of mobs, I'm hitting them all (100% if combined with Proj weakness or Pierce gem and passive). With better gear and more phys dmg, one would need to hit fewer and fewer mobs or have even less leech on gear to achieve the same results. But wait . . . isn't there a cap to how much you can leech? Absolutely. In this case, it's 12.5% of my mana, or .0125*681 = 83. That's enough to cover the 58 I need, which is why this works. This also explains why when I add 'added cold damage' to my setup, it fails. taking my mana cost of 121 and multiplying it by 1.4 = 170 mana/sec needed. Regen was 63 and max leech was 83. 63 + 83 = 146, so we're short of possible mana and unable to sustain. The good news is that my gear will continue to improve, my mana pool will get bigger, my Clarity will level up to 20, and I'll hit the 200 (or more!) total regen/leech needed to sustain a kick-ass 5L or 6L set-up! It's all in the math... I run Clarity (lvl 13 atm, I used lvl 20 in the theorycrafting) off mana. I have a pool of 681, which is enough to run Clarity and Hatred and have 231 mana left over, and I'm not even using Reduced Mana on the Clarity do to poor socket set up. As I continue to level, I should be able to increase my mana pool some more, run Clarity on Reduced Mana, add a 3rd aura off mana, and still have 100+ mana to use for skills. I completely understand about opportunity costs of builds. That's what got me started down the mana ranger road. I was 'this close' to going BM, but after testing it out with BM gems, decided I didn't really like the mechanic. Granted, all depending on build, but it would have taken me 7 'wasted' nodes to get over to the BM keystone. I used 10 nodes to spec into the 3 mana regen nodes around my tree. Spending those three extra nodes lets me: run Hatred (huge dps boost to an all phys bow), run additional TBD aura in the future, use 100% of my LoH and life leech to heal me rather than pay for BM costs. Or, it frees up a support gem if I was instead going to use a BM gem. Is this 'better'? No, not really. I need to get a little mana and mana regen on my gear - not so much that's it'll be a problem, but nevertheless a requirement. It is, however, viable, which is what I wanted to do... Finally, in regards to crit. I have to admit that I failed. I made a mana/crit build on the tree, but when I went to respec it, I would have needed something like 35 respecs, and I'm not that rich yet. My original intent was a max dmg/non-crit evasion/dodge ranger, and I'll stick with that for now and put my mana/crit build on the shelf for a later time. Thanks for the words, Tref |
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No offense taken. If a mana variant of this build can be made to work in endgame, it would be incredibly awesome and many kudos to you for making it to 67 so far without being completely flask reliant, that is not an easy task.
I still disagree on the workability of your build in endgame, and will continue to do so until you prove me wrong by making it work. Wish you luck and I will update the OP to reflect mana sustainability your way if it does, because that would be REALLY AWESOME. Argument below. Yes, 43 mana per shot can be sustained on leech and regen. 70 can be done with a bit of +mana. It all fell apart at about 100 mana per shot when I went GMP, 5 linked, though I admit I've never actually pushed it with that many mana and regen nodes. " That's another problem I have with your build, the scalability of it. If it can't sustain 80 mana per shot at 3.0aps, you're in trouble at endgame. Numbers compiled below for easy math. Also, your gems reach level 20 when you reach the level ~86 range, assuming you've been using them since level 1. This is relevant to Clarity. Ice Shot (16) LMP/GMP (1.5 and 2.0 respectively) Cold pen (1.5) WED (1.7) LoH/LL (1.5 and 1.3 respectively) Options for 6th slot: AFD, Pierce, FA, Conc.E, AoE (1.3, 1.1, 1.15, 1.6, 1.5 respectively) Granted that math is a poor substitute for actually going out and doing it, but "it's all in the math..." is a poor substitute for the hard numbers. And now we come to the big one: 50% regen maps. No regen maps. Reflect maps/mobs that force you to throttle your DPS (and therefore possibly leech) in order to survive. And yes, 50% regen means regen from all sources including mana leech. I'm using a mana variant now, the only one that worked in my experience. Now that I can deal with reflect, I am finally coming to the "any map any mod" stage which is where I target all my builds to go. Suppose it's time to update the OP. How to make a build: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/510084
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