All I have been doing past 2 days is trying to rush and fix my boots with harvest (that harvest screwed up with shit tier roll) so it’s hard to get excited about any of this when my ability to fix my gear may not exist next league.
And this is the exact issue with current harvest.
You can go around and remove add endlessly until you have every mod at T1, you don't see anything wrong with that?
You have ways of removing specifically suffix or prefix and make your chances better at removing the mod you want. You want this game to have literally 0 chance and luck, you want all crafting to be determinsitic?
actually, yes
3.13 Was the best league ever!
3.18 Rest in peace my beloved recombinators, I'm gonna miss you...
All I have been doing past 2 days is trying to rush and fix my boots with harvest (that harvest screwed up with shit tier roll) so it’s hard to get excited about any of this when my ability to fix my gear may not exist next league.
And this is the exact issue with current harvest.
You can go around and remove add endlessly until you have every mod at T1, you don't see anything wrong with that?
You have ways of removing specifically suffix or prefix and make your chances better at removing the mod you want. You want this game to have literally 0 chance and luck, you want all crafting to be determinsitic?
Tbh I didnt spend much time to think about it since Im a pretty new player; but after reading what you just wrote then Yes. Why is it bad that you can spend time and effort and know that you will get returns in even fine tuning the items?
Just like Heist; you dont have to do it if you dont want to(hehe)
There are so many ways to play this game, what is the problem in some people loving to craft pure t1 mods? I fail to see why that should take away the joy from anyone else, doing what they want. You dont drop less exalts because someone else drops more.
All I have been doing past 2 days is trying to rush and fix my boots with harvest (that harvest screwed up with shit tier roll) so it’s hard to get excited about any of this when my ability to fix my gear may not exist next league.
And this is the exact issue with current harvest.
You can go around and remove add endlessly until you have every mod at T1, you don't see anything wrong with that?
You have ways of removing specifically suffix or prefix and make your chances better at removing the mod you want. You want this game to have literally 0 chance and luck, you want all crafting to be determinsitic?
Well what are the alternatives? Lets see..
Alteration/fossil spam for days and still dont get good enough gears? Not only is that boring as hell, it can take up hours if not days. Massive waste of time. If you think spending time in harvest is bad well good luck doing this instead.
Or.. everyone's favorite chaos spam and finishing with exalt slams :DDDD
Trust me if theres no improvements on the crafting system, the best thing for the lower/mid or even upper mid tier players can do is just buying the gears you want.
PS. if you think making the best gears in the league is 100% deterministic with harvest then its either you havent made one or dont know how crafting works or both.
Last edited by kingyang16#1523 on Mar 25, 2021, 8:45:22 AM
Its proven that in order to keep people interested you dont reward them consistently with deterministic rewards, you reward them sometimes. As bad as it may seem RNG is the way to keep players playing. Im to lazy to search for those studies so you can do it on your own.
I will remind people, there is a thread going strongly on Harvest subject right here
Ignore_unrelated_Harvest_Topic
"
kuciol wrote:
"
Anngrat wrote:
actually, yes
Its proven that in order to keep people interested you dont reward them consistently with deterministic rewards, you reward them sometimes. As bad as it may seem RNG is the way to keep players playing. Im to lazy to search for those studies so you can do it on your own.
There is a flaw with your logic.
Harvest crafting is derteministic as in "You control what is affected" but there is still a lot of RNG involved.
Unless there is a craft "Change Elemental 1 resistance to Tier 1" or "Reroll numbers in affixes to the highest", there is still a lot RNG involved.
You need the right seeds (Quite easy, but still RNG) and THEN get the right craft with those seeds (Likely, but RNG again). On top of all that, you need to get lucky so your craft turns out like you hoped for (More RNG). ALL OF THIS is behind the map, so you might run 3-4 maps before 1 Harvest Groove.
People are using "Derterministic" a bit too loosely. Even Harvest has lots of RNG involved, but its controled RNG.
"In mathematics, computer science and physics, a deterministic system is a system in which no randomness is involved in the development of future states of the system. A deterministic model will thus always produce the same output from a given starting condition or initial state."
You can manipulate an item's affixes to reduc the RNG to almost nothing and a very few of them turns to deterministic. But those require the proper base items.
All I have been doing past 2 days is trying to rush and fix my boots with harvest (that harvest screwed up with shit tier roll) so it’s hard to get excited about any of this when my ability to fix my gear may not exist next league.
And this is the exact issue with current harvest.
You can go around and remove add endlessly until you have every mod at T1, you don't see anything wrong with that?
You have ways of removing specifically suffix or prefix and make your chances better but you literally want the game to be 0 luck and all endless trade until youre item is all T1 with elevated mods?
Nope when it takes anywhere between 0 and 1 month to find that one remove/add mod specific to the attribute you need, I don't see anything wrong with that. Oh and not only that, that attribute can actually get worse as that is what happened in my case, so now I am looking at another week or 2 weeks or month to find that fucking mod and attempt at a better roll.
What is wrong with harvest is trade and rapid accessibility to doing what you are describing if you are not grinding it out yourself. This is what is wrong with harvest. You make it out like SSF players and people who don't engage in trade just "endlessly" slamming T1s on the precise mods they need because you know, you are guaranteed those exact mods every time you see harvest. Right.
Edit: you could be one of those looking at reddit seeing those nice all t1 quad-elevated helmets and concluding yeah that must be harvest fault. No that's trade and accessibility to harvest fault. Exacerbate that by teams pooling together and engaging with trade to hunt for mods they need and the problem becomes worse. Sure those items are a problem and all Eternal Orbs are crying right about now (or laughing), but that's not the mechanics fault or its rarity for individual players that are not doing any of that shit and just want to casually upgrade their gear.
I'm not a reddit warrior no. I am talking in a softcore trade perspective, I should have clarified that.
Making them super rare will just end up them costing way more and most normies will go and see it to the ones crafting top end.
I do 100% agree with you on the ssf perspective. But the reality is that they dont balance the game around ssf, I play ssf a lot myself.
I would love to be able to what you talk about if they could solve the problem-
Its proven that in order to keep people interested you dont reward them consistently with deterministic rewards, you reward them sometimes. As bad as it may seem RNG is the way to keep players playing. Im to lazy to search for those studies so you can do it on your own.
Not working with me, if i see, that a CHANCE to upgrade will cost me houndreds of exalts, it's time to stop and wait for next league
Ability to plan my craft ahead - the best way to craft, to minimise the cost and exclude rng, was the best experience I ever got in poe, gonna miss it
"
Funinyourgame wrote:
I will remind people, there is a thread going strongly on Harvest subject right here
Ignore_unrelated_Harvest_Topic
"
kuciol wrote:
"
Anngrat wrote:
actually, yes
Its proven that in order to keep people interested you dont reward them consistently with deterministic rewards, you reward them sometimes. As bad as it may seem RNG is the way to keep players playing. Im to lazy to search for those studies so you can do it on your own.
There is a flaw with your logic.
Harvest crafting is derteministic as in "You control what is affected" but there is still a lot of RNG involved.
Unless there is a craft "Change Elemental 1 resistance to Tier 1" or "Reroll numbers in affixes to the highest", there is still a lot RNG involved.
You need the right seeds (Quite easy, but still RNG) and THEN get the right craft with those seeds (Likely, but RNG again). On top of all that, you need to get lucky so your craft turns out like you hoped for (More RNG). ALL OF THIS is behind the map, so you might run 3-4 maps before 1 Harvest Groove.
People are using "Derterministic" a bit too loosely. Even Harvest has lots of RNG involved, but its controled RNG.
"In mathematics, computer science and physics, a deterministic system is a system in which no randomness is involved in the development of future states of the system. A deterministic model will thus always produce the same output from a given starting condition or initial state."
You can manipulate an item's affixes to reduc the RNG to almost nothing and a very few of them turns to deterministic. But those require the proper base items.
it is directly related, if you remove favourite toy in upcoming league, you should counter-offer something really good, i really hope that ultimatum league mechanic would amazing, and it wont be reskinned ritual, because i stopped clicking on them month ago
3.13 Was the best league ever!
3.18 Rest in peace my beloved recombinators, I'm gonna miss you...
Last edited by Anngrat#4621 on Mar 25, 2021, 10:17:57 AM
