[3.3 Updated] MoM`s bloody Gladiator: when bleed actually does the job

Hello there.

I have a question if it's not a problem. How do you sustain yourself with this build? I see some passive life/mana regen nodes, and minimal life leech from Bloody Bludgeon, but nothing else. You mentioned the lab enchant, but that needs to be acquired in the first place. Do you rely entirely on potions, and healing from block in addition to the previous? There should still be mana issues from MoM since you have no ES, and mp is always depleted when you don't block.

The thing is, a friend uses this build as a basis for his. But only as basis, because he doesn't believe in following guides word by word... So he's not taking MoM, because he doesn't want to micro manage his mp (which is understandable for someone who never used it). He also runs a life leech support on sunder, and warlord curse as he said he couldn't sustain himself otherwise. This is why I'm trying to gather some info about this subject.

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chronos923 wrote:

Spoiler

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Ramireus wrote:

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chronos923 wrote:

Hey, I'm doing your build right now in 3.1, but I am wondering about 1 thing. Is unbound ailments really worth it? I am using Ruthless in substitute, from what I am seeing, it is better with the hits + the bleed. What are your thoughts on it?

Glad to see someone play this build and I welcome feedback :)

I was thinking about this link quite a lot and when cosidering standing dps, ruthless is definitely better-mainly due to hit dmg. I am probably biassed against ruthless gem, I do not like the mechanics much as it gives me uneven dps. Another issue I have with this gem is reflect, which could kill you on ruthless strike, so reflect maps can become an issue, but I have not tested this (if you try it, I will be happy to hear results).

Unbound ailments gives important longer bleed, which helps in high level encounters, where movement is crucial and hit dmg becomes less important.

My general thoughts then are, that ruthless will help with lower content, while unbound ailments will increase in value the higher you get, as you might struggle to keep 8 bleeds up whole fight without it.

Yes I have tried it, and it's pretty good I must say. I've tried it until tier 14, and as you have just said, it works well with the trash mobs, especially with the rares in particular. Although as of the moment, I have changed it to damage of full life, as most of the time I'll most likely be in full life due to block + life gain on hit on the block of the surrender. I don't really know if it's stronger or not because honestly, things just die too quickly for me to notice.

This is actually the first build ever since idk, closed beta, that I have grinded the gear from start to almost end game. Build is just that good, it rarely dies and it's pretty strong from the get-go. Though same with all hard hitting builds, it's a pretty slow mapper, that's why I used blood rage to generate frenzy charge and that helps a bit.

I now had some time to compare these gems, I will compare for my char from last (harbinger) league for shaper fight:

Ruthless
-hit dmg 16.8k
-DoT dmg 17.7/s (5s)
-standing dps 186.2k
-dmg per hit 105.3k

Damage on Full Life
-hit dmg 18.1k
-DoT dmg 19.4/s (5s)
-standing dps 203.4k
-dmg per hit 115.2k

Unbound Ailments
-hit dmg 12.1k
-DoT dmg 16.8/s (7.7s)
-standing dps 166.5k
-dmg per hit 141.5k

What can I tell as result is, that from standing dps, DoFL performs best, will have fastest clear (highest hit, even damage) and low content boss-kill time. Ruthless offers simmilar standing dps, bit lower but I would say more reliable, on some fights staying on full life can be tricky, especially whne facetanking.

From damage per hit perspective, unbound ailments wins by significant margin and that can count very much on guardians/shaper fights.

In the end, I guess all are viable alternatives and will come mostly to personal taste, as differences will be in real figt minor.

Blood rage idea is actually quite neat, I may test it and include in the guide, thank you for pointing it out.

Thank you for response and I like to hear you enjoy the build.

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gnorbert17 wrote:

Hello there.

I have a question if it's not a problem. How do you sustain yourself with this build? I see some passive life/mana regen nodes, and minimal life leech from Bloody Bludgeon, but nothing else. You mentioned the lab enchant, but that needs to be acquired in the first place. Do you rely entirely on potions, and healing from block in addition to the previous? There should still be mana issues from MoM since you have no ES, and mp is always depleted when you don't block.

The thing is, a friend uses this build as a basis for his. But only as basis, because he doesn't believe in following guides word by word... So he's not taking MoM, because he doesn't want to micro manage his mp (which is understandable for someone who never used it). He also runs a life leech support on sunder, and warlord curse as he said he couldn't sustain himself otherwise. This is why I'm trying to gather some info about this subject.

Hello and thank you for taking interest in my build. First (easiest part) I will adress mana issues. Key is to have a lot of mana. You need to have ideally "equal" ammount as you need for your MoM shield, in reality little more. "Equal" means in this case mean for each 7 HP you need 3 MP, then you will practically always die before "going out of mana" issue :) so mana micromanagement is not a problem and since I am using hybrid flasks, you pop them at the same time as your HP goes down. That is for bursts. For sustain, you have 230+ % increased mana regeneration rate, which when combined with huge mana pool, clarity and little mana gained from hit (in mob groups it does at lot of hits from aftershocks), you will not have much problems with sustain even without boots enchantment. If you will, take battle rouse and it will all add up and you will be fine.

For life issues, you have again bit of everything-passive 7.2 % HP regen, some life leech (again, much much stronger in groups), panic enduring cry and heal on block. Each of these things by itself is not enough, but combined they put you into quite safe position as you can see in videos.

Look at for example 1:03 at shaper fight to see how fast you recover without flask or triggered boots ench, it is not intant, but it is fast enough. In general, when you get hit that much that you feel insecure with what you have left, you should move from facetanking into range (sunder works even in range easily).


For your friend issues, warlords mark is good choice, but life leech support is not the best choice, as he will feel it very much later on (general rule of thumb is to never use life leech/mana leech on main dmg skill-exceptions exists). I will ommint common and obvious things (resist cap...) and I would focus on block chance, does he have 50+ % without rumi? Does he use the surrender or at least life gained on block shield? Another problem might be armor-does he have resonable armor (5k++)?

You can also post to me his build (best would be acc and char name for me to look at it in path of building, or pastebin directly), so I can take a look and give him more specific pointers.

Hope my response is not too chaotic :)

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Ramireus wrote:

Hope my response is not too chaotic :)

Thank you very much, and sorry for my late reply.

For some reason I managed to convince my friend about a few of your suggestions. He dropped the leech and faster attacks supports, replaced them with proper Sunder gems, so his damage seems to be good (as good as a 4L can be).
He also got himself a Rumi (no idea why only now), so with it he has block cap I believe. The only problem is the lack of Versatile Combatant skill, he put Blood in the Eyes first by accident, so there's no spell block. Though he rarely dies (and if it happens, it's due to chaos damage), so right now he's doing fine in t10-11 maps.
No life gained on block shield (especially not The Surrender), he just got his first exalt drop yesterday. But he's working on it. The armor value should suffice, I believe he's over 10k.

If you're interested, here's his profile:
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/Recreator24/characters
The character should be obvious, there's only one Gladiator.

However be ready for some headache. As I said, he's not planning to get MoM, and couldn't make him change this decision, so the skill tree went a "bit" different from yours. This makes the build to be different from yours, so I guess the same principles won't really apply.
Also, he's refusing to get a golem as "they are annoying".

Again, thanks for your help.

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gnorbert17 wrote:

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Ramireus wrote:

Hope my response is not too chaotic :)

Thank you very much, and sorry for my late reply.

For some reason I managed to convince my friend about a few of your suggestions. He dropped the leech and faster attacks supports, replaced them with proper Sunder gems, so his damage seems to be good (as good as a 4L can be).
He also got himself a Rumi (no idea why only now), so with it he has block cap I believe. The only problem is the lack of Versatile Combatant skill, he put Blood in the Eyes first by accident, so there's no spell block. Though he rarely dies (and if it happens, it's due to chaos damage), so right now he's doing fine in t10-11 maps.
No life gained on block shield (especially not The Surrender), he just got his first exalt drop yesterday. But he's working on it. The armor value should suffice, I believe he's over 10k.

If you're interested, here's his profile:
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/Recreator24/characters
The character should be obvious, there's only one Gladiator.

However be ready for some headache. As I said, he's not planning to get MoM, and couldn't make him change this decision, so the skill tree went a "bit" different from yours. This makes the build to be different from yours, so I guess the same principles won't really apply.
Also, he's refusing to get a golem as "they are annoying".

Again, thanks for your help.

Your friend made quite significant updates with that exalt I see :) He got The Surrender and Belly of the Beast.

Versatile combatant would be nice, but he should be now able to do UberLab without problem, anyway if he does not die (often) it is not as necessary.

Golems are annoying, I can only agree with this assumption :)

Now I will try to focus on what problems I see:

Skill gems
-onslaught supports nothing
-two curses-can´t apply both (maybe intentional)
-can´t use both auras (maybe boss/farm switching?)
-Enduring cry is really good for boss fights, he could use that too

Gear
-he should definitely update rings, as those are really not for him (he is using 2-3 lines from all those, he can get better for 1 chaos
-similarily he can get better head (more HP) cheaply, boots will be more expensive (suggesting higher movement speed, he will notice much faster clear)
-I would suggest using divine on Belly of the Beast (as life bonus can´t be lower)

Skill tree
-at the begining he can get life instead of attack speed (extra 150 HP with current gear)
-he could use Diamond Skin, as he has uncapped ressist (fire)
-he can save one skill point by regretting tree after resolute technique and get to constitution from bottom
debatable-not sure if right part of skill tree is worth it. It is 11 points for 7 % block chance, some armour and few minor bonuses. I made several adjustments in his skill tree and I believe results are quite good-capped resists, 700 more HP and two extra jewel slots at cost of block reduction (53 from 60, with versatile combatant and better rolled rumi still capped), 3.5 % bleed dmg decrease (jewels will more than fix this) and need to ge little stats on rings (9 dex and 10 int, easy to get more). There are few more minor changes, like 1 % more evade, 2 % phys reduction, lower leech rate, but higher HP regen.

http://poeurl.com/bI89

One possible problem can be that this would be finished at lvl 90/94 (adding HP nodes from scion area and endurance charges), so if he expects to get to higher levels, it would be better to stick to the "north" skill tree way, as it offers more options for skill point use (indominable, combat stamina and possibly tireless)

Take this as recomendations of course.

P.S. he is not using Oak? He went with eramir for extra skill points?

hello guys
tried to play that build, but with some my thoughts and addings.
u can check my profile if u want.
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/sherigan/characters/sheriganabyss
Ulab done on lvl 78, normal atziri just too easy, all guardians down, will try shaper\elder soon


current stats in PoB:

ill try to get 6l belly next, just to boost my HP (+ ~460 hp PoB stats)

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Ramireus wrote:

Your friend made quite significant updates with that exalt I see :) He got The Surrender and Belly of the Beast.

Yeeeah, he got another exalt, and a belly drop after I wrote this. Lucky bastard did it again, in legacy league he chanced a Skyforth on like second try?

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Ramireus wrote:

Skill gems
-onslaught supports nothing
-two curses-can´t apply both (maybe intentional)
-can´t use both auras (maybe boss/farm switching?)
-Enduring cry is really good for boss fights, he could use that too

Some things are also mystery, even for me. He does know he can't use both curses, and the Vitality aura only leeches exp I believe.

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Ramireus wrote:

P.S. he is not using Oak? He went with eramir for extra skill points?

He did went with the extra points...

Anyway, thanks a bunch for going to this extent. I'll relay all these to him, though it may take some time as he's in night shift this week. I kind of did this behind his back, but no doubt he'll benefit from your advice.

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sherigan wrote:

hello guys
tried to play that build, but with some my thoughts and addings.
u can check my profile if u want.
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/sherigan/characters/sheriganabyss
Ulab done on lvl 78, normal atziri just too easy, all guardians down, will try shaper\elder soon


current stats in PoB:

Spoiler

ill try to get 6l belly next, just to boost my HP (+ ~460 hp PoB stats)

I see MoM version is not much in favor :D

I definitely envy you your axe-that is grand piece of equipment. Bloodgrip is also interesting choice for life based build, solving bleed problems.

You have higher standing dps than my version for sure, I would just be worried about physical reflect maps.

Thank you for sharing, some food for thought :)

Taiwan server player here and played this build as my Abyss league starter.
This build is amazing. It has almost everthing I want (Sunder, DoT, mobility, defensive mechanism etc)
and I'm already 93 and made it to T16 maps without breaking a sweat.
Thank you for making and sharing this build. :)

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oldkan96 wrote:

Taiwan server player here and played this build as my Abyss league starter.
This build is amazing. It has almost everthing I want (Sunder, DoT, mobility, defensive mechanism etc)
and I'm already 93 and made it to T16 maps without breaking a sweat.
Thank you for making and sharing this build. :)

Glad to hear that and enjoy :)