Cleave

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which is the 10% buff...

before:
0.7 * 2 * 0.6 = 0,84 damage effectiveness

now:
0.8 * 2 * 0.6 = 0,96 damage effectiveness

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Lipa_ wrote:

"

which is the 10% buff...

before:
0.7 * 2 * 0.6 = 0,84 damage effectiveness

now:
0.8 * 2 * 0.6 = 0,96 damage effectiveness

Which is a 14% damage buff for dual wield. And puts bdual wield something like 20% ahead of single weapon in damage.

You know, it's funny. My first high level character back in closed beta was your basic Dual Strike + Cleave ranger. While I have a tendency to push hard to get into areas that drop better items and therefore was underleveled, Merciless Act 2 began to still seem a little over the top at the time. In retrospect a lot of that had to do with Cleave's power level and my lack of wealth, and not as much to do with a misunderstanding of game mechanics.

Let us contemplate Ground Slam.

Wonderful skill, Ground Slam. It's a ranged attack that hits half the screen, while still working with the powerful Melee Physical Damage supports. 80% damage effectiveness, AND it has 25% Stun Threshold Reduction. That stuns as though you had ~25-30 more damage (being a virtual ~100% damage effectiveness) and makes it a very safe skill.

Cleave, is not a ranged attack. Not much of one anyway; it's much closer to being a point blank attack. If we added 25% for being melee, the effectiveness would be 100%. If we added an adjusting factor for the lack of Threshold Reduction (we'll say 1/2 the stun threshold value lost), its effectiveness would be 112.5.

Even at 110% I wouldn't want to use it - having a ranged attack like Ground Slam is just more efficient: You don't have to walk off the path you're on as much to engage monsters, and monsters will melt before you'd have even reached them in melee.

At any rate a damage increase has the dual effect of making it safer to use at the very least. It'll never be a GOOD skill since it's not ranged and won't Stun-lock bosses as Heavy Strike does, but at least it could get away from being almost Chimney Imp status. 100% would make it Reave-competitive... though not really.

Whats the point of having damage effectiveness of 80% Cleave compared to Reave 100%? This if you want to use shield.

Reave even has alot bigger radius. Not to speak of Reave being able to use Daggers thus being able to build crit build with dagger crit passives.

When dual wielding Dual strike blows Cleave out of water.

Best
Cudez

I'm thinking about making a Cleaver. Does the change in the new patch in any way make them better? 65% damage effectiveness for dual wielding, how good is that? What was it before?

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tachiKC wrote:

I'm thinking about making a Cleaver. Does the change in the new patch in any way make them better? 65% damage effectiveness for dual wielding, how good is that? What was it before?

check top of page...

So now its 130% for dual wield? And 100% for single weapons? From 0.8 to 1.0 is quite a buff unless I am mistaken.

Will main weapon damage be lowered when dual wielding with an incompatible weapon?
For example sword+claw.

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kolton wrote:

Will main weapon damage be lowered when dual wielding with an incompatible weapon?
For example sword+claw.

When dual wielding if both weapons aren't compatible you can;t use the skill last I checked.

You're right, I completely forgot about that.