About Curse Immunity

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

Agree that outright nullification is too extreme. There probably should be some kind of "reduced curse effect/duration" monster affix, but not immunity.

^This seems like the most logical road to walk.

Specifically so since there are curse increased efficiency nodes etc which in a full-on curse build would alleviate some of the down-side presented of this mod.

Instead of shutting down an entire play-style or build, it would simply be punishing like a modifier should.

And real dedication to the build would be rewarded with a less severe drawback.

Peace,

-Boem-

Actually, should probably use both... either reduced curse duration OR reduced curse effect as a monster affix, then the other gets used as a map affix.

Should be a similar deal for stun: one affix to give an x% chance enemies avoid stuns, one to reduce enemy stun duration.

OT: and/or increased stun recovery.

The point is that there are so many different kinds of variables, all consumed by a simple word. One word fits all means one size; not many.

It was said many times already:

Make "Monsters can have 1 less curse on them" instead of curse immunity (still leads to curse immunity if you dont have additional curse items/nodes). If you feel that too "
easy" for curse build, add some "Monsters get X% reduced curse duration on them" and "Monsters get Y% reduced curse effect on them".
That will make curse builds suffer, but not even close to total curse annihilation we have now.

Otherwise, make "crit immunity" mod for map, and see 100500 whine threads about it!

"Monsters can have 1 less curse on them" seems like the easiest solution to the whole plan of "don't completely hose those who go into curses, make it tough for those who don't", but the only issue I have with it is that it further makes additional curses the only curse mod that matters, when I'd imagine GGG would want to encourage curse-focused builds to want to take those other curse nodes.

I would rather see mobs have a huge reduced curse effect modifier (like, 80-90%), and all those "increased curse effect" nodes buffed (or add more sources of increased curse effect like in gear) so that a player reasonably specced into curses could bring that reduced curse modifier to something like 40-50%.

I have been secretly raging at curse immunities ever since they destroyed my first favorite character, my tricurse fireball proliferater...

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gilrad wrote:

"Monsters can have 1 less curse on them" seems like the easiest solution to the whole plan of "don't completely hose those who go into curses, make it tough for those who don't", but the only issue I have with it is that it further makes additional curses the only curse mod that matters, when I'd imagine GGG would want to encourage curse-focused builds to want to take those other curse nodes.

I would rather see mobs have a huge reduced curse effect modifier (like, 80-90%), and all those "increased curse effect" nodes buffed (or add more sources of increased curse effect like in gear) so that a player reasonably specced into curses could bring that reduced curse modifier to something like 40-50%.

Making choices matter is good.

The most ideal situation is one where no single build can cover all of its bases all of the time, but instead can predict.. There should always be potential for a random situation where the combination of affix absolutely throws a wrench in your plans. Outright immunity consumes all potential for such diversity, and instead we're left with a binary decision. That's too easy.

In spite of all its efforts, simple truth is the game is softcore because too many decisions are binary as such.

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Soepkieken wrote:

Immunities are bad design... remember the Diablo 2 monster immunities to certain types of damage? It meant either you faceroll, either you suck... just because of 1 characteristic.

They should remove all immunities from the game and replace them with strong modifiers:

=> Curse immunity = 50% less curse effect, 50% less curse duration.
=> Stun immunity = 50% chance to avoid stuns, 50% faster recovery.
=> Freeze immunity = 50% chance to avoid freeze, 50% less freeze length.
=> ...

But also the contrary of immunities shouldn't exist, like:

RT: instead of ALWAYS hit, something like +5000 accuracy. Evasion would have troubles with RT, but at least it wouldn't be made completely useles like it's now the case.

Exactly,

My personal choice would be to reduce the chance to apply curses on "curse resistant monsters" i.e. 80% dodge chance for curses , but once it landed it sticks for the full effect, with passive that pierce this dodge built into the important curse nodes.

I had an evasion character on hardcore some ways back that relied exclusively on evasion and blind, met an exile with Viper Strike and Resolute Technique, that fight was retarded.

These design choices are clearly placeholders, and I'm surprised the community isn't outraged about them.

I was really impress by the 2 pages surge of message. So I feel like giving some of my point of view.

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Diphal wrote:

I'd hightlight Blood Magic. It's perfect example of absurd map mod. Either you do not care and therefore such mod is just free quantity for you, or you just can't do it.

Again, map mods is ok since (like blood magic) it is a very rare mods on map. You can always reroll the maps, switch to another character, trade the map or just get yourself carry by other.

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MegaDeth666 wrote:

My personal choice would be to reduce the chance to apply curses on "curse resistant monsters" i.e. 80% dodge chance for curses , but once it landed it sticks for the full effect, with passive that pierce this dodge built into the important curse nodes.

Curse dodge is not really good, since curse on hit on ball lightning will be better than manual cursing. And if you keep the same duration, well, just double spam the skill and that's all there is to do.

There is kind of the same problem with less curse duration, you just need a little time to kill all the mobs, and you repeat the skill on boss. Less duration will not impact significantly to be a real penalty.

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BunnyGlobe wrote:

All of us here know this issue where one build get nullified by game design doesn't limited to curse oriented buid but to most unique build as well. Atziri pretty much the key tag where most builds are garbage against her.

I strongly disagree for Atziri. Atziri is a specific boss that need to be seek out to be done. It seems pretty normal that not all build can do it.

That said, I'm not here for stun immunity mods... but I feel it should share the same fate (except if we go "monster can have 1 less stun" :p)

Thanks all for your contributions, may the Dark Thought come back soon!

EDIT: I remember, but couldn't find the post again for quote, that someone was suggesting introducing crit immunity. The problem is that crit is a stat that is found more often and need a real investment in term of tree, gear, currency... It is here to be an end game goal, that reward the investment. Going hexa curse support didn't cost me anything. If I was spending lots and lots of time farming, trading and looting to get perfect gear to do this, then yes, I would have said it is the same thing. But adding crit immunity just because there is stun immunity or curse immunity is just really, really bad. (Again, adding a mod that say less critical strike chance is better than just immunity and would not impaired people who invested in crit)

better solution that simplifies all of this...

monsters have chance x% chance to dodge curses.

its as simple as spell dodge or attack dodge. just another mechanic that balances it all out without a huge nerf to either side. =D

still makes hexacurse viable and useful instead of useless... even if its 50% chance to dodge u get half ur curses applied without being just another leecher.