The Avatar of DOUBLE DIPPING [45k-87k DPS for less than 10 Exa!]

Hey, just want to ask some questions regarding this build
1. Do you think that concentrated effect support gem would work better? It provides a much higher damage at the cost is some areas, which can be some what mitigated by hoa, also, would you think that it will provide more single target dps
2. If I had some end game maces, would you recommend them over doryani, maces like mirror worth gears?

Anyway though, really nice build! Being trying to use it now.

Sorry for the late reply on these. Thanks for the interest!

Facebreakers wouldn't work with this build since you can't use weapon elemental damage. There's no real point in using AoF then.

zbzszzzt123, glad you liked the build! :D

1. Concentrated effect would boost DPS superbly and works particularly well against bosses. BUT that doesn't help with crowd clearing given the smaller area and the great amount of damage you're already doing. I would say it's personal preference based.

2. Mirror worthy gear will definitely be as good, if not better, than using Doryani's. You lose out on the double dipping of Doryani's global affixes from both hands, but you make up for it with sheer weapon awesomeness. The reason I used Doryani's and the double dip on the global affix was to get great endgame style DPS for less than 10 exa :)

Hey, really nice guide. In the past i did try to build some similar builds around AoF and the idea you can benefit of several multipliers/node types, like phys/elemental/fire and so. Apart from the obvious way of using infernal blow, i also tried some very awkward stuff, like a bow build, using Blackgleam and burning arrow. I was also thinking of ice shot, Hrimsorrow and fire to cold gem, which could make about 50% of your phys damage fire, then the rest of the phys damage would become cold and then all the cold damage become fire(in order not to loose any damage duo to AoF), this could allow the use of extra cold damage mods and benefit of hatred aura. Another idea i had was of Spectral Throw, with the help of Chernobog. Unfortunately, mostly duo to lack of gears and more insight on the skill tree they all end up as disappointment. Problems i came across were survivability, health/mana sustain, hard to achieve hit chance(without Resolute Technique), hard to meet the dex requirement for bows, hard to spot the appropriate socket colors on the type of armors i use. I am not fan of using RT keystone in this build, since you loose the ignite effect of your crits.
Now, after prolly an year retire from PoE i came to look around and i can see all the improvements and new additions to the game, that could benefit such type of build. Fire nodes are boosted, ofc we dont really use them since phys nodes are usually superior, but still. There are those nice new weapons and generally the new ways of leeching health from elemental damage. Molten strike was also missing, the so needed tool to have some ranged option for your AoF. Herald of Fire.

If you use inferno blow, the corpse explosion also benefits from all your +elemental dmg bonuses

is that considered triple dipping? or dipception?

nice reserved

"

wooli wrote:

If you use inferno blow, the corpse explosion also benefits from all your +elemental dmg bonuses

is that considered triple dipping? or dipception?

Well seeing as the base damage is based on 25% corpse life and not hit damage you couldn't really call it double dipping, it's just benefiting from the same bonuses. What DOES double dip is the ignite from when the explosions crit. IB has an implicit 7% crit chance which might be worth building around considering Dual Doryani's gives you up to 80% global crit chance anyway.

Getting 300% increased fire damage shouldn't be too hard, at which point 0 fire res mobs should chain react when they explode near one another. (I haven't tested that but I would assume the IB explosions mark any nearby mobs as hit by IB also. Could someone correct me on that if I'm mistaken?). Linking Fire pen should also increase explosion damage and chance to chain react.

Explosion damage goes from 25% corpse life to 100% corpse life, then 150% when it crits (base multi), fire penetration multiplies effective damage by an amount (lets say 35% for 0 res mobs) for ~200% corpse life, then ignite is gonna do 80% of that multiplied by 300%, so 480% of corpse life as burning damage.

"

wooli wrote:

If you use inferno blow, the corpse explosion also benefits from all your +elemental dmg bonuses

is that considered triple dipping? or dipception?

Lol, that's true too!

No wonder reflect kept murdering me whenever I used infernal blow. Heh!

I get that "double dipping" is a hot phrase right now but you aren't double dipping on anything as far as I can see. Conversion never double dips, you can reference any forum post on the Iron Reflexes/Leather and Steel debate that happened much earlier in the game's lifespan for a very high exposure discussion on it.

If you are converting all your damage to elemental (in this case to fire) you benefit from physical bonuses and fire bonuses ONE TIME EACH. No double dipping occurs. If you have 100% increased physical damage and nothing else, you have 100% increased damage. Same goes for fire damage. In fact, if you have 100% increased physical and 100% increased fire damage, you only have their sum, 200% increased damage. Physical and fire modifiers both apply ONE TIME to your damage.

The reason people say the fire/burn interaction "double dips" is because your damage is directly affected by fire modifiers twice, your initial hit is greater (and thus the burn is greater) AND the same fire modifiers augment your burn a SECOND TIME, even though it has already benefited from fire modifiers due to a larger initial hit. To go back to the IR debate, a long time ago the keystone used to apply "Leather and Steel" passives (24% incr armor & eva IIRC) TWICE because it affected your armor before and after the conversion. Now it applies one time before conversion as it should, and is NOT double dipping. The "double dipping" that you're claiming occurs with this build is really just your ability to utilize two types of modifiers on your damage.

Yeah, it seems like just semantics or whatever but it's important to maintain the meaning of specific phrases to have clear discussions in an RPG, especially one as language-focused as Path of Exile.

So basically what you're saying is he's dipping his Dorito's scepter into the physical sour cream bowl, then dipping it into the elemental salsa bowl and then sprinkling some Herald of Ash chili flakes on it. Disgusting.

How do you maintain your attack?
With Warlord's Mark and these ugly "mana on kill" nodes only?
Is this by any means reliable?

Or do you drop a gem for BM while not boasting with tooltip DpS? ;)

I'm running Lvl 10 Clarity in a similar build, but that leaves only room for another aura (in my case Herald of Ash).