Thoughts on xp loss as a Diablo 2 Vet

Since everyone is making a thread on xp loss, I’ll throw in my 2 cents also.

I think xp loss is fine in a game like this, but there are a number of factors that make it especially brutal in this game:

1. It kind of gets sprung on you at the end game with no warning.

2. It’s coupled with loss of the map and any rares that you were fighting (I can’t go back and kill those bugs that got me, they’re just poofed).

3. No ability to recover any of the losses.

As a Diablo 2 vet, we had xp loss in that game, but none of these aggravating circumstances. You were introduced to xp loss as a mechanic early in the game (around level 35) at 5%, and only advancing to 10% in the late game. You had the option to go back to where you died and try the content again, or reset it. If you did manage to get your corpse back where you died, you’d get back 75% of the lost xp, bringing the death penalty down to only 2.5%. In that way, you’d have the choice of whether you want to lose the map you were working on or try to go back and recover your xp.

For the talk of this being soulslike, one of the main features of souls games is that you can go and get your souls back if you die. I think a similar mechanic would work here. If you die, but manage to go back to that node and complete it without dying, you get your xp back.

Thoughts?

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Chris1885#6461 wrote:

As a Diablo 2 vet, we had xp loss in that game

yeah. a death drops all the characters items on ground in the body to be recollected by the owner only. if you logout the corpse is in your hideout.

if you die a 2nd time, only the corpse with the most valueable(gold vendor value) carries over into your hideout.

if you manage to pickup all corpses, then no corpses get destroyed/moved to hideout.

for the risk and reward kinda thingy probably just lose all exp% for the chance to get 75% of it back when you pickup the corpse. if not. all level progress is gone. sounds fair.

No, any corpses you had would be back in town so you’d never permanently lose items

A generation of entitlement.
I blame partisan awards.

As someone who thinks the XP loss mechanic is a tool for players to grow, I'm not against the idea of a means to recover after your failure. A pickup seems like a bit much, but maybe if they reimplement more attemps per map, some sort of revenge mechanic where you can get your EXP back by clearing the pack that killed you. Then you can weight whether you think it's worth it to try recover it, risking another loss. This isn't too different anyway from throwing yourself at a map you died on in PoE1 anyway.

It would take some workshopping, but a way to recover from your loss wouldn't be a bad choice.

ANY solution that minimizes or configures it to be turned off will be welcome.

I have no ego. The option in the menu could be called "noob mode" and I'll click it without a problem. It could be turned off by default.

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ClockworkShrew#7536 wrote:

As someone who thinks the XP loss mechanic is a tool for players to grow, I'm not against the idea of a means to recover after your failure. A pickup seems like a bit much, but maybe if they reimplement more attemps per map, some sort of revenge mechanic where you can get your EXP back by clearing the pack that killed you. Then you can weight whether you think it's worth it to try recover it, risking another loss. This isn't too different anyway from throwing yourself at a map you died on in PoE1 anyway.

It would take some workshopping, but a way to recover from your loss wouldn't be a bad choice.

I really like the revenge mechanic idea. Of course, it's predicated on more attempts per map, but I think it'd be a neat way to reward players for 'getting gud' and getting theirs back on their nemesis.

To be honest a "REVENGE" mechanic sounds pretty awesome.
But would not work with the complete map wipes that the game currently uses.

I don't consider the xp loss to be of much of a problem generally. Yes it sucks when you are just about to level up, but you can grind it back and it would put you more on edge.
But the fact that you lose an entire waystone with the mechanics and all AND also your xp, I think that is the main problem. In the first game I don't mind it because I can go back in the map and try again and grind that loss anyways, but when that is not an option is very punishing.

I think there is 3 solutions to this problem:

1. You get rid of loosing the waystone. You loose the mechanics and xp but whatarever currency you dumped on the stone is still there. This one is ok, you keep your stone and can use it on another map with other mechanics.

2. You ger rid of loosing the mechanics. You loose the stone and xp but all mechanics are still in the map, you only need a new stone. This one is what I think would be the fairest, you juiced up your stone a lot and died because of it, try again with less dangerous mods.

3. You get rid of loosing the xp. You loose the mechanics and the stone. This I feel would be the less productive, making 100 'easily' reachable, but is also the one that would feel the best for more casual players and worst for the more hardcore ones.

Id have the same enemies spawn on the map again, but reset the layout. You’d have to use a new waystone of the same tier or higher on the same node.

The waystone parameters will be different and used to make a unique map, but on a revenge map the first yellow monsters to be generated would be a copy of the ones closest to you when you died assuming they’re in a certain vicinity (that way I can revenge both those bugs that killed me).

To get xp back, you have to complete the map (killing all the rares). That provides the same recovery rule if you got killed by a random monster instead of a rare one.

You could do the same kind of thing with sekhemas and chaos: complete the next trial of the same level or higher and get your xp back. In both cases the xp is lost if you use a lower level stone or coin on your next attempt.