[Feedback] Quest rewards feedback

In light of the jewels' manifesto and GGG's intent to update the jewel quest rewards, I would like to suggest improvements to the rest of the quest reward system.
You may find the https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Quest_Rewards useful to navigate the below suggestions.

1)

Issue: Item quest rewards are not meaningful. They are random and more often than not, they end up of little to no use.
Solution: Item quest rewards should be identified.
Reasoning: Currently, there is little to little value in the item quest rewards – having them fill an individual player’s purpose, the power and utility of those items increase; having to weigh item mods against sockets, socket colours and item attribute requirements makes for more interesting, more meaningful choices.

2)

Issue: Classes are gated from skill/support gems from other classes. For example, a Frostblade Duelist currently cannot obtain added cold damage support, a witch cannot obtain Added Fire Support and most spell / spell supports are not available to the Marauder until Fixture of Fate Library quest(Act 3).
Solution: Remove class-specific vendor gems. Once eligible, merchant-purchasable gems should encompass all valid skill/support gems for that stage of game.
Reasoning: This artificial gating is frankly outdated and has serves no purpose in a game. With this change, all classes can have access to the same skill gems and supports at the same stage of game. There is also an added benefit of more options for classes – e.g. marauders can pick more spell skill choices, witches can pick more physical choices, etc.

3)

Issue: The current item rewards incentivize a class theme and not player agency or needs.
Solution: Item rewards across classes should be made uniform. To elaborate - for example, Scion has a selection of 6 different boots bases offered for Essence Of Artist(act 7) quest, while other classes only have 3 that are most adjacent to their attribute type(e.g. Marauder is offered Armour, Armour/evasion and armour/energy shield bases). With this change, all classes would be offered the same selection as Scion.
Reasoning: Item rewards should not be base class-specific – they should fill the players’ purpose and playstyle they choose, not their class’s theme. Standardizing the rewards and increasing the amount of choices should help this goal. The rewards should be diversified across the board. If you are a marauder, you should be incentivized to play a spell caster or a bow user just as much as a melee striker.

4)

Issue: Book of Regrets quests do not fulfill their purpose. Currently, the few (10) regret points do not help to amend tree planning, especially that of new players. Instead, the first few acts should be training wheels/semi-sandbox for new players to familiarize themselves with the massive passive tree.
Solution: Free passive tree respecs for players until end of act 5 or level 45. After “defeating” Kitava in act 5 or reaching level 45, this power is lost, to not devalue regret orbs and to avoid abuse cases(e.g. Delve). I suggested rewards replacing them in 5).
Reasoning: The first few acts should be training wheels/semi-sandbox environment for new players to familiarize themselves with the massive passive tree - it should show a glimpse of what is possible to achieve and offer a individualized solution for any new player and not just any experienced player. This solution also creates space to provide more useful rewards for the current optional quests.

5)

Issue: The quest rewards are of generally low quality and there are gaps in their logic for the stage of game.
Solution: The intent of the below changes is to improve the level of rewards in general, while improving player agency and make sure subtle guidance and familiarization is offered for new players through the itemization/crafting system as the game progresses. I outlined the changes in sets.

5a) Mercy Mission (Act 1): Now offers a rare Coral/Iron/Paua Ring in addition to Quicksilver Flask.
Reasoning: Currently offers a medium life/mana/quicksilver flask, with the latter being an overwhelming choice. Let it be the first reward and introduce a second reward in the form of a rare ring – currently obtainable as a quest reward as late as act 3. The ability to select an iron ring would be especially meaningful for physical characters, which struggle compared to casters at that stage.

5b) A Dirty Job (Act 1) – Now offers a rare dex/str/int amulet.
Reasoning: Early in the game, you miss out on the basic stats opposite to your class. As +10 attribute minor nodes do not solve the issue and +30 attribute nodes are too far, this creates a need for a source of those stats, so you may focus on more satisfactory damage nodes or more meaningful travel nodes. Doing mud flats for your first amulet and a source of attributes opens up a lot of leveling build options.

5c) Essence of the Hag (Act 8) – Now offers 4-linked gloves(ilvl 59~). The two-stone/unset ring rewards are moved to Bestel’s Epic (Act 6) as additional options.
Reasoning: The point of this change is for a player that finished act 8 to have received a 4-link helmet(act 6 – essence of umbra), boots(act 7 – Essence of Artist) and gloves(Act 8). Oddly enough, gloves of any kind are currently not offered, and it's an odd omission in the current quest rewards. Resistance rings are in dire need to players first facing the sudden -30 resistance penalties, so it fits there much better. Getting 3 pieces of non-chest armor from the 3 sub-antagonists also feels thematic.

5d) Fallen from Grace (Act 6) – Now grants a rare Ruby, Sapphire, Topaz or Bismuth flask. The Key to Freedom (Act 5) no longer offers Ruby/Sapphire/Topaz Flask.(not that anyone does at that stage, as granite/diamond flasks are generally preferred)
Reasoning: New players generally do not expect to be hit with the -30 resistance reduction. Act 6 is much better timing to be offered alleviation for the resistance reduction than act 5.

5e) Fastis Fortuna (Act 9) – Now offers 3-linked shields & quivers.
The Storm Blade (Act 9) – Offhand choices are removed. Now offers a larger selection of weapons across classes.
Reasoning: Currently, Storm Blade offers a mix bunch of weapons and offhand items; the idea to upgrade your weapons & offhand following acts 6-8 is filling the remaining gap in itemization, though currently you’re left to choose between the odd weapon or offhand.

5f) No Love for Old Ghosts (Act 10) – Now offers a selection of 5 link weapons. (2-handed staff, axe, sword, mace, bow).
Death and Rebirth (act 10) – now offers a selection of 5 link chest armours. (Pure and hybrid armours)
Reasoning: Act 10 is no time for 4 links. A player is ready for mapping, and a 4 link will barely cut it then. It is a common suggestion in the past, and I am reiterating it here.

5g) Enemy At the Gate (Act 1) – A selection of RGB 3-linked level 2 weapons. Hillock no longer drops RGB linked item.
Breaking Some Eggs (Act 1) – Offers 1 transmutation, 1 augmentation orb and 1 alteration orb.
The Caged Brute (Act 1) – A selection of 3-linked level 8~ chest armours.
The Siren’s Cadence (Act 1) – Offers 1 scouring orb and 1 alchemy orb.
Intruders in Black (Act 2) – A selection of 3-linked level 16~ armours.
Sharp and Cruel (Act 2) – A selection of 3-linked level 18~ weapons.
Lost in Love (Act 3) - A selection of 3-linked level 24~ armours.
Sever the Right Hand (Act 3) – A selection of 3-linked level 28~ weapons.
Breaking The Seal (Act 4) – A selection of 3-linked level 34~ armours.
The Eternal Nightmare (Act 4) – A selection of 3-linked level 38~ weapons.
Reasoning: A lot of the reason behind low player retention in the first acts is because most gear needs to be found from scratch and no resources are acquired to craft them at that point. You are offered gems as a new player, but chances are you will not have the gear to slot it in and support it (outside the beginning weapon) unless you plan ahead of time. A new player has no such acquired foresight and is quickly discouraged from being barred access to the basic itemization mechanic. There is also no familiarization with making gear of your own, and you’re disincentivized to play alternative playstyles which should not be the case.

I welcome your feedback as well as your related suggestions to tackle the current quest reward system and hope to offer more suggestions to tackle different parts of the game.

Big picture I would say the quest rewards are kind of where they want them. They have to be, right? Cause it would be a trivially easy change to change the a10 quest reward to a 5L weapon, or even a 6L armour of choice. So that leaves me to reason that if quest rewards seem bad, mismatched, or otherwise underwhelming, it's probably intentional.

^and this is why the feedback exists...it shouldn't be that way. Side quests are basically ignorable because the gear rewards they provide are trash. Bump up the reward, make the quest meaningful. Devs spent time and energy developing those side stories and side quests only for the vast majority of players to completely ignore them.

Have all rare items offered as rewards come as 4L in Act 1-5, and as 4-5L 6-10. Have all rare rewards be unidentified so people can actually see what might be useful to them in the moment. Other slight buffs here and there can help modernize the quests that simply have not changed since they were introduced years and years ago. They are overdue and would provide no damage to the game. Perhaps have the rares offered include essence/delve mods on them too.

TBH I DON'T think the poor rewards are intentional: i think they are simply outdated. When they were released back in 3.0 (I think that was when 5-10 happened) they were useful to a point. Gear was less powerful overall, and there were far less enemies dropping rare items so getting a nice rare from a quest was pretty cool. Nowadays, essences are everywhere making all rare drops useless.

Look, it's beautifully written feedback, I just think OP is barking at a brick wall. This stuff has all been asked for before. I believe GGG see the quest rewards less as jackpot things to be excited about and more as bad luck protection. GL on the quest to get them changed though! It doesn't change my leveling in any way - like you said: rare gear, 4 links, and essences are everywhere.

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innervation wrote:

Look, it's beautifully written feedback, I just think OP is barking at a brick wall. This stuff has all been asked for before. I believe GGG see the quest rewards less as jackpot things to be excited about and more as bad luck protection. GL on the quest to get them changed though! It doesn't change my leveling in any way - like you said: rare gear, 4 links, and essences are everywhere.

Jewel quest rewards rework is good timing to bring it up, at the very least :)

I'd argue the design space was simply left untouched for way more than 5 years without major challenge - they just don't tackle the current game's problems and changing them would go a long way in securing players.

My suggestions are meant to specifically help new players to:
1) Not get discouraged with the game's vast systems
2) Familiarize themselves with them.
3) Have some training wheels as they do before they get to the "real game".

It's unlikely to be more than quality of life change for experienced players just to adjust for the level of challenge that the updated act 1-2 and soon rest of acts will pose.

With majority of players quitting before end of act 1 and only 10%~ finishing story mode last I checked, I think this is worth addressing.

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Unacceptable wrote:

4)

Overall good ideas but I suggest the free respecs only end once you set foot in Act 6. Or some newbs will kill Kitava and are hit with the negative res and suddenly unable to switch build. Just have a popup before you take the boat so they can decide if they want to stick to their build or play around in Act 5 longer.

Overall every quest should be a choice. Do it and get the item which would be valuable for me or skip so I reach maps faster?
Cause right now everything but skill quests are a easy skip, no question asked.

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MaxW81 wrote:

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Unacceptable wrote:

4)

Overall good ideas but I suggest the free respecs only end once you set foot in Act 6. Or some newbs will kill Kitava and are hit with the negative res and suddenly unable to switch build. Just have a popup before you take the boat so they can decide if they want to stick to their build or play around in Act 5 longer.

Overall every quest should be a choice. Do it and get the item which would be valuable for me or skip so I reach maps faster?
Cause right now everything but skill quests are a easy skip, no question asked.

Some communication regarding -res hits would be great in general, I think with that in mind end of act 5 is fine. Being defeated by Kitava is a good point to say "sandbox time is over". Perhaps have that be in as a skippable pop-up before entering Cathedral.

I doubt GGG would settle for the latter, I think the idea is to make the options attractive, not skippable.

4) everyone would use the strongest tree and skill for their class until act 6.

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Latze wrote:

4) everyone would use the strongest tree and skill for their class until act 6.

First 5 acts are super fast no matter what.

I'd say OP's original ideas are well-thought and I agree on the reasoning behind them. At the same time, I share Innervation's opinion on the fact Quest Rewards have basically never changed during those 10 years, with the sole exception of Act 1's extra reward on a Movement Skill Gem and, well, what happened with Unique Jewel rewards at Act5 and - now - all the other Unique Jewel rewards globally. Maybe GGG is following a "if it isn't broken, don't fix it" policy, rather than a "room to improve" one, at least for PoE1

The one concern I have for OP's ideas is on point 4), but for a diffent reason from Latze - and it's Delve.
Now that Sulphite is account-bound and not Character-bound, it is possible for a character to enter the Mine since Act4 and start delving right away - Sulphite will be provided by another character. This way, the delving character could bypass the whole Kitava's afflictions of Act 5 and 10, even if at a major cost of foregoing all Passive Skill Tree points from Act 5-10. GGG saw this coming, and resistances and exp penalties are still forced on those character when they reach a certain depth.

With 4) active, a delve-only character would be able to always fully respec their tree at no cost, since there is no way for the game to understand the character is bound to the Azurite Mine (like, say, a PvP-Only character) and "reaching a depth" could still be a frail assumption of a character's development.

I'd rather change the "free passive respec" of 4 to a certain character level - 45 being the Area Level for Act 6 Coast may be a threshold - rather than Acts