For 4.0 Revamp, what if PoE transforms the whole mechanism of the passive tree (details below)?

So this idea was kinda brought on by how people are pointing out how D4 seems to be trying to implement their own version of the PoE map system with their new Dungeon Keys. I don't mind cross-pollination of ideas from other ARPGs tbh, so I've no issues with them trying this. But what if PoE took some ideas from its competitors too. With that in mind, this idea is inspired by the rotatable passive tree used in Wolcen (but, unlike with the D4 take, it goes much further).

Wheels within Wheels

For anyone not familiar with Wolcen, its passive tree is basically a set of concentric circles. You start at the center to allocate points until you reach the next circle. However, the circles can be rotated! So the last node in your inner circle can actually connect to a variety of different nodes in different parts of the next concentric circle. You can see what it looks like here - https://wolcen.dev/ However, in Wolcen there's only one set of circles. So what if...?

Wheels across Wheels

In Wolcen, all characters start at the centre of that set of circles, albeit with a different set of initial passive nodes available to them. In PoE of course our chars actually start in different sections of the passive tree. But what if there's more than one set of concentric circles? So basically Ranger would start at the center of one set of concentric circles with a couple of initial Ranger-like passive points to reach the next. This can then be rotated to start focusing on more specific Ranger-like builds (bows, 1-handers, flasks, etc.), leading to maybe a third final one with even more variety. But once you've made your way to the outer edge of that final set of Ranger wheels, depending on where you are on the overall passive map, you can connect to other (probably smaller i.e. less circles) passive wheels as you make your way across the passive map. These circles are rotatable too, which means you have a pick of what kind of nodes you'd like to connect to, but that'd also mean you have more flexibility as to which direction across the map you want to make your way to (as you can always rotate to change direction at every wheel you reach). Eventually, just like now, you'd be able to make your way to the bigger concentric wheels of each of the other starting classes (as well as any Keystones sprinkled across the map).

This also makes Jewels really interesting, as those with a radius affecting other passives could now have a variety of different types of nodes that they could possibly affect, depending on how you rotate the wheels their influence reaches to. But keep in mind that you're still making a connected series of nodes across the passive map, so if you rotate any circles earlier in your chain such that it isn't a continuous chain of allocated nodes anymore, all nodes beyond that point will be inactivated (since they no longer connect to your starting point) - no harm done tho, just rotate it back to reactivate.

Obviously, this would completely trash any pre-4.0 passive builds, but that's inherent to any total overhaul of the passive tree. You should still be able to remake all those builds anew with the new system, as I haven't discussed actually changing any of the nodes themselves. And it should open up all sorts of new paths and potential builds as the passive tree is now even more customizable. The downside is that it's also a lot more complex, but hey isn't complex ARPG building what you're here for anyway? Anyhoo, thoughts? :)
Last edited by Exile009#1139 on Mar 7, 2021, 1:36:54 AM
Last bumped on Nov 3, 2019, 7:07:38 PM
Reported directly to Chris and Paul Taulborg for advertising 3rd-party games.
"Path of Exile's engine is currently modern, lean and fast." - Chris Wilson, September 19th, 2019

"It looks like we broke something with 3.10.0. We don't know what it is yet." - Bex, March 16th, 2020
I like Wolcen's wheel concept a lot.
It isn't super complex but allows for flexible ideas.

I don't see Chris revamping Skilldrassil too much, in terms of the basic structure.
~ I have selective hearing, and today, you have not been selected.
I was thinking something along the lines of the OP.

IIRC POE was originally marketed as a game that offered a lot of flexibility to make your character however you wanted, with the skilldrasil given as evidence of that. That went away when lab and prestige classes were introduced. It would probably stir up quite a bit of excitement if we were given a reason to think that character design was switching once again to a more flexible state. This kind of change would be a prime candidate for moving to a different number over, as well (ie: 3.xx --> 4.00).

Addressing a point briefly mentioned in the OP, I hope Blizz doesn't copy maps for D4. Rifts have a very nice flow to them which makes running them quite enjoyable. In contrast, maps are a pain to manage because there's more busywork to do and we end up making a lot more choices of little significance to manage all that busywork. A sense of flow is harder to maintain with maps, in my experience.

It's other aspects of D3 that make it a disappointing experience, instead of rifts. Hopefully Blizz realizes that.
Now that prestige classes will finally leave lab in 4.0, will GGG get it right this time or will they find new ways to repeat old mistakes?
Last edited by EnjoyTheJourney#0109 on Nov 3, 2019, 7:10:28 PM
What the hell, your link just killed my screen, lol. As soon as it loaded I tried to zoom out and my whole display shut down. I got a notification after saying the Nvidia driver stopped responding and has recovered.

But anyways yeah, I think that'd be sweet.
Need a new signature, cuz name change. I dunno though. I guess this seems fine. Yeah, this is good.

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