Scion's raider perk. wtf?

Scion's raider perk is stronger than actual raider ascendancy class.
Ranger's raider grants you onslaught or phasing on 3 seconds after kill. Scion's raider grants you onslaught and phasing while being on full frenzy charges. To get 3 major effects combined in scion's perk (onslaught, phasing, frenzy on kill) you would need to spend 6 ascendancy points as ranger's raider, but as a scion you get them just for 3 and you are able to get one more ascendancy class perk, like assassin.

What happened here GGG? It is crazy

Peace,

-raxleberne-

so you want perm phasing and onslaught? -1 charges. same with that new estoc.

plus raider only gets a chance to proc, 20% on kill. i agree scion ascendancy raider is amazing

Scion's version of the Juggernaut is really good as well. Cannot be stunned at full endurance charges. Even Marauder's original Juggernaut class doesn't have that.

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xMustard wrote:

so you want perm phasing and onslaught? -1 charges. same with that new estoc.

plus raider only gets a chance to proc, 20% on kill. i agree scion ascendancy raider is amazing

You don't even need any gimmicky uniques to be at max frenzy charges almost all the time. Unlinked frenzy in one socket, boom, sustaining is suddenly not a problem at all. But it is needed only for bosses, when clearing packs you are at full frenzies 90% of time.

Onslaught and phasing 3 seconds after kill look like shit compared to onslaught and phasing when on full frenzy charges.

Peace,

-raxleberne-

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Hlifhildr wrote:

Scion's version of the Juggernaut is really good as well. Cannot be stunned at full endurance charges. Even Marauder's original Juggernaut class doesn't have that.

for CI builds that sounds realy good plus it has 10% to generate one when hit so its self sustained when you need it he most.

you're right, you don't. but most people that will be making a build around frenzy charges (like me) will be looking for something like raider, which will end up giving you massive bonuses to atk, atk spd, movement spd and charge duration along with +1 charge.

i'll end up with 11 frenzies, to which i sustain very easily. phasing and onslaught are great, but it won't be for frenzy charge builds...just builds that happen to end up gaining frenzy charges.

Onslaught and phasing don't exactly give big bonuses, so what's the issue?
So you get 20% attack/cast/movement speed from Onslaught, you can easily surpass that value as a Raider.

If you are using Scion just for that, then, that seems kind of dumb.

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raxleberne wrote:

Scion's raider perk is stronger than actual raider ascendancy class.

If, and only if, your build benefits a lot from phasing. If not, not.

For straight up damagedealing purposes, the Ranger Raider subclass blows the the scion's mini-version out of the water with Rapid Assault/Way of the Poacher/Avatar of Frenzy, even when you only count 50% of what it provides (to correspond to the Scion Raider only being one of two specializations.)

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Hlifhildr wrote:

Scion's version of the Juggernaut is really good as well. Cannot be stunned at full endurance charges. Even Marauder's original Juggernaut class doesn't have that.

It is an interesting setup.

The Marauder Juggernaut can get effective immunity to freezing (you can still be frozen, but it doesn't affect your ability to move or attack) and can make it very hard to be stunned by increasing the stun threshold by 100%.

The Scion Juggernaut gains immunity to chilling always and immunity to stun as long as you are at full endurance charges.

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Starxsword wrote:

Onslaught and phasing don't exactly give big bonuses, so what's the issue?
So you get 20% attack/cast/movement speed from Onslaught, you can easily surpass that value as a Raider.

If you are using Scion just for that, then, that seems kind of dumb.

No, you can't surpass that. Scion's raider grants onslaught on full frenzy charges. Ranger's raider grants 20% chance to gain onslaught 3 seconds after kill. Don't you see the difference? Perma onslaught vs chance to get onslaught for 3 seconds. And 20% to movement speed is quite a big fucking buff to clearspeed.

The point is, combining scion's raider with another scion's ascendancy perk (like assassin) may result in bigger deeps than specializing in raider's ascendancy class. Which would be crazy. You basically would have all major benefits of raider's class (except +1 to frenzy), bigger damage, with more benefits from other perks.

Peace,

-raxleberne-

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Scion's raider grants onslaught on full frenzy charges. Ranger's raider grants 20% chance to gain onslaught 3 seconds after kill. Don't you see the difference? Perma onslaught vs chance to get onslaught for 3 seconds. And 20% to movement speed is quite a big fucking buff to clearspeed.

I call bullshit on what you just said. 20% chance on kill on merciless on? That trigger is hilariously easy. You do know it is about on average 5 kills to trigger right?
And when it doesn't matter, ie. against bosses, that is when you lose onslaught, which isn't a big deal.

You go ahead and make an inefficient build if you think it is better.
As of now, I only see a few combinations that Scion would fit better, but what you said isn't it.